IRC Log from 2009-12-28
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00:39:04 <computerfreaker> Hi OliverK!
00:39:28 <OliverK> howdy computerfreaker
00:40:15 <computerfreaker> How are you doing?
00:40:32 <OliverK> meh
00:40:44 <OliverK> i'm trying to think or why my wireless doesn't work :(
00:41:17 <OliverK> and i thought about flashing it with dd-wrt but decided not to after i read the warnings. to much hassle
00:41:36 <computerfreaker> Is your router on & properly connected (no broken wires, etc.)?
00:41:43 <OliverK> yeah
00:41:53 <OliverK> i can connect to it wirelessly
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00:42:07 <OliverK> and i connect with the wired
00:42:10 <computerfreaker> the router must not be getting a signal
00:42:27 <OliverK> i'm partially afraid its my switch
00:42:35 <OliverK> but i'm not sure
00:42:44 <computerfreaker> you mean your computer's wireless switch?
00:43:00 <OliverK> no. I run the modem to a switch
00:43:07 <OliverK> then i run from switch to router
00:43:08 <computerfreaker> oh
00:43:20 <OliverK> either way, i'm stuck
00:43:37 <computerfreaker> sorry to hear that, hope you can get it up and running soon
00:43:44 <OliverK> me to
00:43:53 <computerfreaker> wish I could be of more assistance, but idk much about wireless
00:43:54 <OliverK> i coulda swore i had it working the other day
00:44:13 <OliverK> eh, even some who can help with the logic will help
00:44:54 <gluxon> OliverK: Wait, can your computer find the network?
00:45:04 <gluxon> Or can it find anything?
00:45:08 <OliverK> heh
00:45:22 <OliverK> i can connect wirelessly, i can see and access the router
00:45:29 <gluxon> Oh. :(
00:45:30 <OliverK> it can't access anything else
00:45:37 <computerfreaker> can the router connect to a different network?
00:45:37 <gluxon> I'm out of thoughts too :(
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00:45:54 <OliverK> computerfreaker: i want it to be part of the same netowrk
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00:46:08 <computerfreaker> I know, but if the router can't connect to a different network the router's probably the problem
00:46:09 * OliverK wonders if Gizmokid2005 is active
00:46:33 <OliverK> nah, i'm trying to connect to the modem, which is supposed to be part of the same network
00:46:38 <Gizmokid2005> OliverK: slightly, yeah, whatcha need?
00:46:58 <OliverK> any ideas why a router won't play nice with my modem?
00:47:21 <Gizmokid2005> Yep, you have the switch in the wrong place
00:47:29 <Gizmokid2005> switches ALWAYS go AFTER a device that can handle DHCP
00:47:40 <Gizmokid2005> go Modem > Router > switch
00:47:41 <OliverK> i turned off dhcp on the router
00:47:42 <Gizmokid2005> problem solved.
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00:47:55 <OliverK> dhcp is handled by my modem
00:48:00 <Gizmokid2005> try it
00:48:04 <Gizmokid2005> I'm willing to bet that's the issue
00:48:18 <OliverK> k. if I get killed, that why.
00:48:37 <computerfreaker> GL!
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00:52:01 <McNinja> back
00:54:01 <computerfreaker> does it work?
00:55:47 <McNinja> nope
00:55:59 <McNinja> i'm in #gizmokid2005 discussing it
00:56:23 <computerfreaker> just joined you there
00:56:29 <McNinja> cool
00:59:18 <gluxon> McNinja?
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01:55:29 <GizmoBot> Bensawsome is from the PortableApps.com forums, likes waffles VERY MUCH, and has a site at http://www.bensawsome.com . He also maintains StatBot and the IRCStats pages @ http://www.ircstats.info
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04:43:53 <GizmoBot> ChrisMorgan is a PortableApps.com developer and moderator
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04:48:13 <GizmoBot> ChrisMorgan is a PortableApps.com developer and moderator
04:49:27 <ZachThibeau> I successfully compiled possibly the first binary of gnu icecat on windows :)
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04:51:52 <GizmoBot> ChrisMorgan is a PortableApps.com developer and moderator
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04:52:08 <GizmoBot> computerfreaker is working on KidSafe and TopOCR, and would very much like to have folks test it and give feedback
04:53:22 <computerfreaker> ZachThibeau: I was just checking over the IRC logs, congratulations on getting that IceCat build done! :)
04:53:34 <ChrisMorgan> .g IceCat
04:53:34 <GizmoBot> ChrisMorgan: http://gnuzilla.gnu.org/
04:54:18 <ChrisMorgan> Couldn't remember which was which in the Ice series... so that's it.
04:54:29 <ZachThibeau> http://zachthibeau.com/index.php/download/GnuIceCatWindowsBuild.7z :D
04:54:32 <ChrisMorgan> ZachThibeau: has no-one ever compiled it on Win32 before?
04:54:46 <ChrisMorgan> index.php/... yeuch.
04:54:56 <ZachThibeau> as far as I could see on the internet there was talk about it but no work was attempted
04:55:14 <ChrisMorgan> WordPress... I understand ;-)
04:55:22 <ZachThibeau> so I called it a possible first and not neccesarilly the first ;)
04:56:55 <ZachThibeau> so it doesn't mix with your current firefox install :)
04:57:33 <ChrisMorgan> ZachThibeau: next step: make a launcher for it with the same AppID as it to try and see if you can get the 7 bar thingy unified
04:57:49 <ChrisMorgan> I reckon it's worthwhile testing out to see if you can
04:57:57 <ChrisMorgan> Dunno how it's done though
04:57:59 <ZachThibeau> well I got icecat compiled for gluxon since he wanted to make it portable
04:58:25 <ChrisMorgan> Incidentally ZachThibeau the linky at http://zachthibeau.com/jquery-test-and-my-desktop-view-yet-once-again/ is completely broken
04:58:40 <ChrisMorgan> Opens a lightboxy window which doesn't work, the link to pagamesclan.com/kde.png doesn't work either
04:59:01 <ZachThibeau> yeah I'm working on fixing that
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05:00:08 <ChrisMorgan> I do recall looking at the "Is it Windows 7 or KDE?" thing a couple of months ago with my Dad... it's fascinating how it's all perceived.
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05:01:08 <ZachThibeau> some of the boxes being empty could be the fact I moved servers and lost some files so that could be the reason
05:01:27 <ZachThibeau> and I tested an addon with icecat and so far it installed and is working
05:01:35 <ChrisMorgan> Good :-)
05:01:50 <ChrisMorgan> How about addon compatibility, does IceCat use the same GUID as Firefox?
05:01:55 <ChrisMorgan> And version numbers?
05:02:21 <ZachThibeau> iirc it has it own but some extention authors added icecat to it and icecat has a list of compatible extentions
05:02:58 <ChrisMorgan> So long as you can do extensions.checkCompatibility
05:07:29 <ZachThibeau> in case some people can't open the 7z file of icecat I do have a zip version available http://zachthibeau.com/GnuIceCatWindows.zip
05:07:43 <ChrisMorgan> Size of each?
05:08:00 <ZachThibeau> the reason some may have issues with the 7z archive as I'm using some new features in 7-zip alpha that is out
05:08:07 <ChrisMorgan> Don't offer zip... it corrupts the world!
05:08:16 <ChrisMorgan> Oh /ho/! LZMA2?
05:08:49 <ZachThibeau> yeah
05:10:17 <computerfreaker> ChrisMorgan: size of 7z build: 7.20 MB; size of zip build: 11.3 MB
05:10:33 <ChrisMorgan> See? ZIP is evil!
05:10:56 <ChrisMorgan> ZachThibeau: LZMA\Ultra and the maximum available compression with zip?
05:11:23 <ZachThibeau> no the zip I just used defaults
05:11:30 <ZachThibeau> anyways I need sleep
05:11:38 <ChrisMorgan> Gni'te
05:11:47 <ZachThibeau> it's 1:11am and I need to wakeup at 5am for work -_-
05:11:48 <computerfreaker> 'night ZachThibeau! Thanks for the build!
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06:17:36 <Chappie> att: forumadmin@gizmokid2005.com -- Dear Forum Administrator: Your "forum" is apparently a joke but it's far from practical. I thought it was a little too juvenile but in my haste I ignored my intuition. "Information You have been permanently banned from this board. Please contact the Board Administrator for more information. Reason given for ban: Bogus user account. A ban has been issued on your us
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06:27:21 <GizmoBot> ChrisMorgan is a PortableApps.com developer and moderator
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06:34:16 <GizmoBot> ChrisMorgan is a PortableApps.com developer and moderator
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06:38:45 <GizmoBot> ChrisMorgan is a PortableApps.com developer and moderator
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06:42:25 <GizmoBot> ...
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07:04:12 <TimClark|id> Hello Chappie , are you active?
07:05:19 <TimClark|id> Is there a reason that you are complaining about your ban in another channel in this channel?
07:07:55 <TimClark|id> Please understand that Gizmokid2005 's role in another channel is IRRELEVANT to his role in this channel
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07:12:28 <TimClark> Very well, i will assume you are inactive at the moment Chappie and will see this later, your difficulties in another channel are not relevant here, even if we share a member
07:14:26 <TimClark> And, as Gizmokid2005 is an op in this channel we are inclined to take his view on any matter involving a matter in his own channel
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07:16:01 <TimClark> So, I would suggest you take up your difficulties up with him Outside of this channel, otherwise you are likely to be banned here as well
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08:10:00 <WastePotato> err, k
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09:31:26 <Rocky> Hello
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10:23:42 <GizmoBot> Bensawsome is from the PortableApps.com forums, likes waffles VERY MUCH, and has a site at http://www.bensawsome.com . He also maintains StatBot and the IRCStats pages @ http://www.ircstats.info
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16:02:02 <JohnTHaller> hola
16:02:06 <Gizmokid2005|AFK> hello JohnTHaller
16:02:06 *** Gizmokid2005|AFK is now known as Gizmokid2005
16:02:17 <JohnTHaller> how goes it
16:02:21 <Gizmokid2005> it goes, and you?
16:02:36 <JohnTHaller> not bad. just got back from a week away late last night.
16:02:45 <Gizmokid2005> sounds fun :)
16:03:12 <Gizmokid2005> you ready for that Songbird release now?? lol
16:03:29 <JohnTHaller> Is it done done? Tested and ready for official release done?
16:04:12 *** ZachT|ZNC is now known as ZachThibeau
16:04:34 <Gizmokid2005> I've had the PR up for a while, with no issues, found nothing in my testing in my VM nor in my daily use.
16:04:45 <JohnTHaller> Other testers?
16:05:05 <ZachThibeau> howdy :D
16:06:12 <Gizmokid2005> JohnTHaller: over 85 downloads with no reported issues
16:06:19 <Gizmokid2005> well, I lied
16:06:22 <JohnTHaller> Alright/ O
16:06:33 <ZachThibeau> whats new people :)
16:06:38 <Gizmokid2005> over 465 downloads, no reported issues
16:06:48 <Gizmokid2005> not to mention, songbird went from 1.4.1 to 1.4.3 in less than 3 days
16:07:05 <JohnTHaller> I only have 1.4.2 from you via email.... is 1.4.3 on site
16:07:05 <JohnTHaller> ?
16:07:25 <Gizmokid2005> JohnTHaller: http://papps.gizmokid2005.com/Songbird/SongbirdPortable_1.4.3.paf.exe
16:07:34 <JohnTHaller> DLing
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16:08:05 <JohnTHaller> I hate hydrairc
16:08:21 <Gizmokid2005> Yeah, the useless spam is annoying
16:08:32 <Gizmokid2005> I've never used it...some people swear by it though...
16:09:06 <ZachThibeau> it's ok but I prefer PChat :P
16:09:42 <JohnTHaller> You know the revision of 1.4.3 in SVN for Songbird?
16:09:53 <Gizmokid2005> yeah moment
16:10:07 <Gizmokid2005> you can actually check by the download from their site, it's in the installer name
16:10:09 <ZachThibeau> speaking of which I almost got a new build of it out using MiniGTK making PChat close to what the shareware version but completely free
16:10:29 <Gizmokid2005> JohnTHaller: r1438
16:10:36 <JohnTHaller> No, that's their public build numbers
16:10:52 <JohnTHaller> Their current revision is 16921
16:10:56 <Gizmokid2005> ...oh
16:11:01 <Gizmokid2005> then no, I don't know offhand sorry
16:11:32 <JohnTHaller> Any thoughts on the dualing splashes?
16:11:36 <JohnTHaller> dueling even
16:12:07 <Gizmokid2005> I've had a few. I like the idea of a combined splash, but at the same time, would we then want to disable Songbird's or the installers?
16:12:24 <JohnTHaller> Depends on how quick Songbird's comes up
16:12:30 <Gizmokid2005> because that's where my hesitation comes in...if we disable the launchers and just have the songbird splash, it still takes a while for the initial splash to come up.
16:12:38 <Gizmokid2005> whereas the launcher's is instantaneous
16:12:39 <Gizmokid2005> BUT
16:12:47 <Gizmokid2005> on the same hand, SB's splash goes away when the app window opens.
16:13:51 <ZachThibeau> anyways I need testers, I compiled most likely the first windows port of Gnu IceCat (pretty much firefox but with the closed source components removed and is GNU Approved) and I want to make sure it works properly before making a portable release of it
16:16:15 <ZachThibeau> anyone willing to lend a hand in checking it out, I could use the extra eyes for bug catching
16:21:43 <JohnTHaller> Gizmokid2005: how bout we cut down the time the PA.c splash shows for songbird. How long do you think the songbird splash takes to come up from flash?
16:22:01 <Gizmokid2005> hmmm, not sure JohnTHaller, but give me a moment, i'll test from one.
16:22:28 <JohnTHaller> Make sure it's a fresh run and none of the EXEs are prefetched
16:22:34 <Gizmokid2005> yeah
16:23:50 <Gizmokid2005> I forgot how long a big install takes on an actual flash drive...lol
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16:35:47 <JohnTHaller> done yet?
16:36:14 <Gizmokid2005> working on it
16:36:27 <Gizmokid2005> apparently it's prefetched, as it only took about 5 seconds for SB's splash to show up
16:36:33 <Gizmokid2005> which doesn't seem quite right.
16:36:56 <Gizmokid2005> and as the laptop of the house got hosed by a bios update I can't test on it yet, I'm still working on reinstalling drivers for it.
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16:41:17 <Gizmokid2005> well JohnTHaller, maybe it is
16:41:25 <Gizmokid2005> I'd say drop it to the standard splash time again
16:42:05 <JohnTHaller> so 2 seconds?
16:42:10 <Gizmokid2005> yeah
16:42:13 <Gizmokid2005> that should be plenty
16:42:24 <Gizmokid2005> songbird's splash should hit by then, or VERY shortly afterwards
16:43:34 <JohnTHaller> Ok
16:43:53 <JohnTHaller> I've got the source up and the launcher updated. I'll push it out today after I post PA.c Installer 1.0.2.
16:44:59 <Gizmokid2005> awesomesauce. Thanks JohnTHaller
16:53:01 <dbdii407> Morning everyone. :)
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17:31:28 <GizmoBot> digitxp has his old launchers available at http://portableapps.com/node/21283
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17:40:29 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is awsome and is currently working on a super cool media player called musicplay3000 aka mp3k
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18:19:07 <alpha1beta> Hello
18:19:28 <Gizmokid2005> hey alpha1beta!
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18:19:58 <alpha1beta> Hey gizmo, I've been messing with that music tracker, I think that live tweeter thing changed something
18:19:59 <digitxp> where is everyone
18:20:16 <alpha1beta> wait...now its working...
18:20:30 <Gizmokid2005> alpha1beta: /join #gizmokid2005
18:20:32 <alpha1beta> ok
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19:00:02 <GizmoBot> computerfreaker is working on KidSafe and TopOCR, and would very much like to have folks test it and give feedback
19:00:21 <computerfreaker> Hi guys!
19:01:54 <ZachThibeau> hey computerfreaker did icecat work?
19:02:22 <computerfreaker> I tried running it in a sandbox but no luck, it was around 2 AM so I gave it one shot and went to bed
19:02:27 <computerfreaker> trying again, w/o sandbox, right now
19:02:34 <ZachThibeau> kk
19:02:44 <computerfreaker> nice icon, btw
19:03:23 <ZachThibeau> thats the icecat logo that I turned into a windows icon
19:04:47 <computerfreaker> I'm playing with IceCat right now... looks pretty much like Firefox, but it's significantly slower :(
19:05:29 <ZachThibeau> odd in my tests on my system and in my vm is that it was 2 secs faster than the stock firefox build
19:06:25 <computerfreaker> I just tried loading addons.mozilla.org in Firefox and in IceCat; Firefox loaded it in 5 seconds, IceCat's still trying to get it
19:07:07 <computerfreaker> now IceCat finished loading AMO.... I'll try my school site next
19:07:17 <ZachThibeau> 6 sec load for me on icecat and about the same for firefox for me too :/
19:08:02 <computerfreaker> maybe something to do with caching, or perhaps NoScript sped things up in Fx
19:08:15 <computerfreaker> at any rate, my school site was impressively quick on IceCat; loaded about the same as Fx
19:08:25 <ZachThibeau> possibly
19:08:32 <ZachThibeau> and cool :)
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19:09:32 <computerfreaker> any plans for a portable build?
19:11:17 <ZachThibeau> gluxon wanted to do one but had no binary to work with so I'm going provide him the binary
19:11:26 <computerfreaker> ok
19:11:52 <computerfreaker> NoScript installed OK on IceCat... I'm going to try another addon right now
19:12:07 <ZachThibeau> most addons and themes work with icecat
19:13:02 <computerfreaker> looks like the second addon works OK too
19:14:39 <computerfreaker> ZachThibeau: what kind of addon wouldn't work with IceCat? It's just a custom Firefox build...
19:14:50 <Guest22044> darn splits...
19:15:01 <ZachThibeau> so far everything is working properly
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19:17:55 <computerfreaker> ZachThibeau: what kind of stuff does IceCat leave behind on the host PC? I'm planning on "cleaning house" today... ;)
19:18:36 <ZachThibeau> the only bugs I encountered was setting it as default browser not setting and the about box and the settings can be found in app data folder under .gnuzilla and gnuzilla
19:19:10 <computerfreaker> thanks
19:19:37 <computerfreaker> yeah, you're right about the "about" box - it returns a parsing error instead of anything meaningful
19:19:53 <ZachThibeau> I consider that minor really
19:20:16 <computerfreaker> yes, that's a minor error overall
19:21:04 <ZachThibeau> something I can fix in the next build I'm just looking mostly for functional bugs
19:21:19 <computerfreaker> haven't run into any of those yet
19:21:53 <ZachThibeau> well like I said setting as default browser doesn't work :P
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19:22:51 <ZachThibeau> I may keep it like that for portability sakes when gluxon works on it
19:27:01 <computerfreaker> or perhaps use some sort of command-line switch (although idk how hard that would be)
19:28:56 <computerfreaker> I have to go, I have a Physics test and 2 Calc tests waiting :(
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20:25:18 <gluxon> LOL!!! There's an Eclipse icon in the AptanaStudio exe :P
20:25:45 <JohnTHaller|away> Not surprising really since it's just a mildly customized Eclipse install
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21:00:13 <gluxon> Anybody know if HKCR requires admin privs to edit?
21:00:36 <JohnTHaller|away> i think it does
21:00:54 <JohnTHaller|away> I think everything but HKCU does actually
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21:02:54 <GizmoBot> computerfreaker is working on KidSafe and TopOCR, and would very much like to have folks test it and give feedback
21:02:59 <computerfreaker> gluxon: I don't think it does
21:03:25 <computerfreaker> I had an app that set a custom file association, and (IIRC) it worked on my XP limited account
21:03:34 <gluxon> :(
21:03:40 <gluxon> Com'on :(
21:03:45 <gluxon> Aptana uses the registry :(
21:04:04 <gluxon> Aptana Portable would be done if it didn't :(
21:04:50 <computerfreaker> gluxon: how bad is it?
21:05:17 <gluxon> Well, if John's right, then Aptana's using registry that requires Admin privs.
21:05:27 <JohnTHaller|away> Try it with a limited account?
21:05:33 <JohnTHaller|away> Or DropMyRights?
21:05:36 <gluxon> Good Idea :D
21:05:54 <computerfreaker> I had an app that set a custom file association, and (IIRC) it worked on my XP limited account
21:05:59 <gluxon> Oh, it launches a cmd on first startup that requires admin privs... that's bad, right? :(
21:06:19 <JohnTHaller|away> Ah... does it HAVE to complete?
21:06:37 <gluxon> Not really. Doesn't effect the app if the cmd doens't launch at all.
21:06:51 <JohnTHaller|away> Is it a seperate CMD file? Can you edit it
21:07:22 <gluxon> Let me check.
21:10:01 <gluxon> Oh shoot, it really is registry dependent O_O
21:10:36 <gluxon> The AptanaStudio executable launcher was unable to locate its companion shared library <-- That's bad :/
21:14:54 <computerfreaker> by "shared library", I assume you mean DLL?
21:15:16 <computerfreaker> try putting it immediately next to the executable; that's an old trick to avoid DLL **** and other such problems
21:15:19 <gluxon> IDK.
21:15:28 <gluxon> But I found the bat file it's running :D
21:16:11 <JohnTHaller|away> so what is it setting? is it a class or file association? can you do the HKCU equivalent instead and have it work?
21:17:11 <gluxon> Not sure. I'll do a full regshot.
21:18:40 <Gizmokid2005> gluxon: you can just pull the bat file's contents and see what it's doing...
21:18:48 <computerfreaker> gluxon: want to post the bat file on, say, pastebin?
21:18:57 <computerfreaker> I'd be happy to look at it
21:21:10 <gluxon> Actually, there's like 7 bats :/
21:21:35 <computerfreaker> O_O
21:21:45 <computerfreaker> how long are they?
21:32:36 <gluxon> IDK :P
21:32:41 <gluxon> Okay, the regshot is finished.
21:32:44 <gluxon> It looks bad :/
21:34:28 <gluxon> Done --> http://gluxon.tk/Other/~res.htm
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21:35:53 <gluxon> Why's there so much HKLM? :(
21:36:27 <Gizmokid2005> gluxon: that's not bad at all...
21:36:55 <Gizmokid2005> HKLM\SOFTWARE\Classes\aptanaplugininstaller and it's subs need to be gone
21:37:27 <Gizmokid2005> that's it
21:37:36 <Gizmokid2005> so try it in a limited user account and see what you get.
21:37:39 <Gizmokid2005> if it will even run
21:38:01 <gluxon> It'll run fine. :D
21:38:12 <Gizmokid2005> in a limited account?
21:38:15 <Gizmokid2005> what's the regshot look like?
21:38:25 <gluxon> I don't know.
21:38:36 <gluxon> But the aptanaplugininstaller keeps comming back on each launch. :(
21:39:17 <Gizmokid2005> of course, which is something you'd have to code into the launcher to clean up...
21:39:22 <Gizmokid2005> which isn't hard...
21:39:24 <gluxon> And the cmd prompt won't go away until you get those registry keys on the machine.
21:39:28 <Gizmokid2005> and why I asked about the limited account...
21:39:31 <gluxon> Okay.
21:39:38 <gluxon> BRB
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21:49:49 <gluxon> Okay, I wanted to release this today, but because of these registry issues, I'll have tommorow :)
21:50:41 <JohnTHaller|away> gluxon... is eclipse ready to go you think?
21:55:09 <gluxon> Yeah, it is.
21:55:55 <JohnTHaller|away> Alright. Could you get all the appropriate source code for your build out of CVS and 7z it up so we can post it to SF?
21:56:19 <gluxon> But Chris Morgan told me to wait for some universal launcher to release before Eclipse Portable becomes official. Subversion is the only problem but other than that, there's been no post for bugs or anything problems for like a months.
21:57:14 <JohnTHaller|away> Isn't Eclipse all we use that uses subversion right now app-wise? What else is in the pipe?
21:58:03 <gluxon> I don't know. Chris Morgan is doing SubCommander Portable.
22:01:01 <JohnTHaller|away> Ah
22:01:09 <JohnTHaller|away> How often do new eclipse releases come out?
22:01:44 <gluxon> Like once or twice a year.
22:02:04 <JohnTHaller|away> sub-versions like bug fixes I mean. I know their major ones are June each year.
22:02:11 <JohnTHaller|away> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eclipse_%28software%29#Releases
22:03:53 <gluxon> I don't know. But 3.5.1 came out about a month after 3.5 and there hasn't been an update since.
22:04:20 <JohnTHaller|away> Yeah. Maybe we should hold off til we have a complete solution... Or we could do a revision in, say, Feb or March when we do the SVN stuff
22:04:39 <gluxon> Ah. Okay :D
22:04:41 <JohnTHaller|away> BTW - looking at the Eclipse builds, it looks like there is tons of overlap: http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/packages/compare-packages
22:04:48 <JohnTHaller|away> Why don't they do a 'complete' build?
22:05:22 <gluxon> You can have the option to do a custom build.
22:05:37 <JohnTHaller|away> How much bigger would it be than the other ones?
22:05:56 <gluxon> Well, with all of them, Eclipse would be huge :(
22:06:21 <Gizmokid2005> gluxon: huge as in like 300M or huge as in like 1.5G?
22:06:23 <JohnTHaller|away> Classic is 201MB.
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22:06:41 <JohnTHaller|away> Does classic do C++, Java and PHP?
22:06:47 <gluxon> Possibly like, 500-700
22:06:49 <gluxon> MB
22:06:58 <gluxon> It does when you install support for it, like I have.
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22:07:15 <JohnTHaller|away> Oh, classic includes the source, which is why it's so big right?
22:07:22 <gluxon> No. :(
22:07:34 <gluxon> My Eclipse Portable build is 465 MB (487,638,279 bytes), with PHP, Java, C++, NSIS, and Aptana.
22:07:36 <JohnTHaller|away> According to the matrix it does... http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/packages/compare-packages
22:07:45 <JohnTHaller|away> What about without aptana?
22:08:25 <gluxon> Wait, are you talking about Aptana Portable's size, or the plugin for Eclipse?
22:08:55 <JohnTHaller|away> If we had an Eclipse Portable build that combined C++. Java and PHP (arguably the most common reasons for using Eclipse)
22:09:33 <JohnTHaller|away> What exactly is Classic? From the matrix, it doesn't seem like it includes much of anything except the basics plus the source.
22:10:01 <gluxon> Yeah, we could easily combine them.
22:10:49 <JohnTHaller|away> They seem to bury the Classic download last on the page... so the question is... does anyone really need the extras in classic normally? If no... what size would C++ + Java + PHP be?
22:11:28 <gluxon> C++ seems to be the smallest build, for some reason. I haven't found any source code for Eclipse inside the Classic edition.
22:11:53 <gluxon> But according to that page, Classic is just the platform with Java programming support.
22:12:13 <JohnTHaller|away> Then what is Java edition?
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22:12:39 <gluxon> I don't know :'(
22:12:52 <gluxon> Just looks like it has more tools for Java developers.
22:13:13 <JohnTHaller> Weird that they don't really explain it better. You'd think they'd move to one main all in one build
22:13:30 <gluxon> Yeah, i know.
22:14:01 <JohnTHaller> Only thinkg Classic seems to have that the Java edition lacks is plugin development support
22:14:33 <gluxon> Ah.
22:14:53 <gluxon> Wait, Java's JUST for java developers.
22:15:07 <gluxon> Classic has the PHP support too. Wow, that's surprising :/
22:15:17 <JohnTHaller> You sure?
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22:15:27 <gluxon> Oh whoops, sorry, no it doesn't :/
22:15:38 <gluxon> PDE == Not PDT
22:15:42 <Hiccup> :)
22:15:48 <gluxon> Hi Hiccup :D
22:16:29 <Hiccup> hi there
22:16:41 <JohnTHaller> Java EE seems to be the most popular download... by a lot... and we don't have the one portable.
22:16:56 <gluxon> I could whip up a Portable one right now :D
22:17:20 <Hiccup> ohmygosh its John Haller
22:17:23 <JohnTHaller> Maybe we should see what Java EE plus PDT plus CDT would be size-wise.
22:17:36 <Hiccup> *wets pants*
22:17:51 <gluxon> I'll let me check. Might take a while to dl everythign.
22:17:53 <computerfreaker> Hiccup: that was my reaction too :) (although I didn't go quite that far :P )
22:18:26 <JohnTHaller> Ok. It would be interesting to release it as a "Universal" build. for folks rather than all those different ones.
22:18:50 <gluxon> :)
22:19:28 <Hiccup> iv NEVER seen John Haller in here
22:19:32 <computerfreaker> ditto, Hiccup
22:19:42 <JohnTHaller> i used to be in every day. been a bit sparse the last month or so.
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22:20:08 <gluxon> Hiccup: I've never seen you in here :P
22:20:21 <gluxon> Okay, maybe one time before :/
22:20:21 <Hiccup> Yes you have
22:20:21 <computerfreaker> John, would you mind answering a quick question? (Don't worry about saying no, it's not a big deal)
22:20:32 <JohnTHaller> sure,. sup
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22:21:02 <IEB> :P
22:21:04 <computerfreaker> I was wondering if there's any particular person I should ask to review an app before it's declared ready for primetime
22:21:45 <JohnTHaller> no one in particular. just be sure it's in the beta forum first and publicly tested by a few folks. hopefully we'll have the dev test team reformed soon.
22:22:09 <computerfreaker> ok, thanks
22:22:17 <IEB> Hey John, i was looking at the test releases page awhile back
22:22:21 <computerfreaker> that was what I had thought, just wanted to be sure
22:22:31 <JohnTHaller> IEB: what about it?
22:23:47 <gluxon> JohnTHaller: Just curious, think you'll let another person into the Dev Team? :D
22:24:08 <JohnTHaller> yeah, a few will be dropping out. we're gonna reform it from scratch essentially
22:24:30 <gluxon> Oh. :(
22:24:37 <IEB> Well most of the apps on there seem to be dead but that isnt what i wanna ask you about now. There's an app on there that i thought would be nice to have, and i thought id give it a try myself
22:24:51 * gluxon is scared to ask who's dropping out <-- Don't answer that!!!!
22:25:42 <gluxon> IEB: Which app? You have to ask the developer to take over. Or if they haven't been active for more than a year, work on it until that person comes back.
22:26:00 <IEB> it's basically an emulator of the gameboy advance platform. So i thought id give it a try but i was wondering if there were any legal issues with you guys releasing it?
22:26:40 <IEB> It can run homebrew stuff but 70% of people use it to play pirated games
22:26:45 <gluxon> Oh, VisualBoy Advance?
22:26:51 <IEB> yeah
22:27:09 <gluxon> Prapper's still active, but he's got a bunch of other stuff to work on too.
22:28:00 <gluxon> So in other words, I say he'll let you take over :D
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22:30:04 <gluxon> Hi ptmb.
22:30:08 <IEB> Yeah but i mean it can be used to play pirated stuff. So would pa.c want to release or would it be considered legally unsafe?
22:30:15 <ptmb> hi gluxon
22:30:27 <ptmb> gluxon, lets talk in -ot for a sec
22:30:48 <Gizmokid2005> IEB: the point that people can play illegal things on it, doesn't make it illegal
22:30:51 <Gizmokid2005> just like BitTorrent
22:30:53 <Gizmokid2005> or uTorrent
22:31:06 <JohnTHaller> We can do emulators... but we only encourage and support their use with legal and legitimate games. That means homebrews... or ROMs where you have the game in certain locations in the world (but not in the US).
22:31:11 <Gizmokid2005> most people probably use torrents for illegal file sharing, such as music, videos, etc...
22:34:10 <IEB> JohnTHaller: i was also wondering about why there are so many apps on the test releases page. Why don't people finish up apps that they start working on?
22:35:50 <IEB>
22:39:04 <JohnTHaller> The biggest problem was testing. We formed a dev test team to much fanfare... and then they didn't really do anything.
22:42:31 <IEB> JohnTHaller: I just wanted to get your perspective. I'm just really curious because alot of the time youll see a bunch of apps released on a certain date by somebody. And then elsewhere on the list youll see the same person, several months later, has released a several more. Why do they start work on more instead of continuing to work on the earlier ones? And why, for that matter do they do two or three in one go? Why not work on one, then finish it up, then
22:44:05 <gluxon> IEB: Well, some apps are more important than others.
22:44:43 <gluxon> For example, I started AkelPad Portable a year ago, then worked on Eclipse Portable. Eclipse's Priority is higher than AkelPad's.
22:48:18 <gluxon> JohnTHaller: Okay, Eclipse is about 284 MB when all those releases you mentioned are merged.
22:48:39 <gluxon> Not including extra langs and the portable parts.
22:48:48 <JohnTHaller> hmm...
22:51:59 <IEB> Does the guy who started visualboy advance ever come in here gluxon?
22:52:38 <gluxon> prapper?
22:52:41 <gluxon> Not often.
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23:00:12 <gluxon> I have to go for a while.
23:00:15 *** gluxon is now known as gluxon|gone
23:00:21 <gluxon|gone> Back in like 10 minutes.
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