IRC Log from 2010-02-18
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02:49:04 <pa_8566> Hi
02:49:21 <Computator> hello
02:49:29 <pa_8566> Needed some help with Portableapps Chrome
02:49:39 <Computator> ok
02:49:50 <pa_8566> I've installed on my WIndows 7 laptop, no issues
02:50:18 <pa_8566> but installing it on 2 PCs that runs XP pro, it didn't work
02:50:35 <Computator> what did it do?
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02:51:14 <pa_8566> I usually create under C:\Program Files\Portableapps
02:51:22 <pa_8566> then click on the exe
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02:51:46 <pa_8566> My VLC & Firefox are there, no issues
02:52:02 <pa_8566> i.e. C:\Program Files\Portableapps\FirefoxPortable
02:52:22 <pa_8566> & C:\Program Files\Portableapps\VLCPortable
02:52:33 <Computator> ok, what does it do when you click on the exe?
02:52:43 <pa_8566> Nothing happens
02:52:53 <Computator> oh ok
02:53:08 <pa_8566> I saw under task manager the chrome.exe appeared for a while then nothing happens
02:53:35 <Computator> I haven't used it by itself, only with the portableapps menu...
02:54:03 <pa_8566> So anyone can assist?
02:54:14 <Computator> but i think it has to have the menu running for it to work, because it uses that to tell when to copy some files back and forth
02:54:32 <Computator> but i don't know for sure
02:54:55 <Computator> so you may have to have the menu installed and running for it to work correctly
02:55:05 <pa_8566> Like I mentioned, it works fine in WIndows 7, but not on my other 2 XP Pro PCs...
02:55:07 <Computator> just for chrome that is
02:55:12 <Computator> oh
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02:55:28 <Computator> i haven,t used it in 7, only in xp
02:55:51 <pa_8566> btw, how to install the menu?
02:56:00 <Computator> it works fine for me in xp
02:56:04 <Computator> just a sec...
02:56:33 <Computator> http://portableapps.com/suite
02:57:11 <pa_8566> Oh... the full suite...ok I'll try
02:57:19 <pa_8566> thanks.
02:57:29 <Computator> yw
02:57:40 <Computator> you can just get the menu by itself
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02:58:03 <pa_8566> ok... thanks.
02:58:25 <Computator> the whole thing doesn't hurt though ;)
02:58:45 <TimClark> Computator: to the best of my knowledge None of our apps require the menu
02:59:19 <Computator> I know it's supposed to be like that but I do use chrome portable
02:59:21 <TimClark> oh, and pa_8566 we do not recommend the use of c:\Program Files
03:00:08 <Computator> and it waits on the PAM to know when to copy some files back and forth
03:00:33 <TimClark> If that is the case something is wrong or different
03:00:38 <Computator> I haven't tried it without, but that is one reason it might not work
03:00:41 <Computator> idk
03:00:50 <TimClark> ips
03:01:02 <Computator> ips?
03:01:09 <TimClark> i'm pretty sure
03:01:16 <Computator> ahhh ok
03:02:07 <TimClark> all of the "clean up" work is supposed to be handled by the app launcher, not the menu, unless something has changed that i don't know about
03:02:07 <Computator> idk, mabye. that's the only semireasonable reason i could think of ;)
03:02:19 <Computator> no, the menu doesn't do it
03:02:31 <TimClark> would you be willing to launch chrome w/o the menu to test it
03:02:43 <Computator> the app launcher waits for the menu to exit and then does it's own cleanup
03:02:45 <Computator> sure
03:02:45 <pa_8566> I can recopy or reinstall elsewhere... trying now
03:02:48 <Computator> just a min
03:02:52 <TimClark> portable chrome of course
03:02:56 <Computator> yeah
03:03:05 <Computator> using regular now ;)
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03:04:05 <pa_8566> Hey guys!
03:04:16 <pa_8566> what do you know!!! It works!!!
03:04:28 <TimClark> by the way, i should say i don't use chrome and know nothing about it, but unless something has change the apps do not require the PAP to run
03:04:28 <pa_8566> Just copied it out of C:\program files
03:04:49 <TimClark> c:\program files is a magic/dangerous place
03:05:01 <Computator> lol
03:05:06 <TimClark> Windows treats it diffenrtly then other places
03:05:13 <pa_8566> Ok, I'll make it a golden rule #1, do not use program files!!!
03:05:34 <pa_8566> Thanks all, Cheers, James.
03:05:38 <TimClark> program files is fine for installed programs, that is what it is ment for
03:05:46 <TimClark> bye
03:05:53 <pa_8566> Bye!
03:05:59 <Computator> idk if chrome REQUIRES the pam (checking now) but it definitely uses it to queue up when it does certain things
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03:06:23 <TimClark> queue up ?
03:06:35 <Computator> not really queue
03:06:53 <Computator> just waits for it to exit, then cleans up etc...
03:07:07 <TimClark> that does not make sense
03:07:40 <Computator> :) that's how it does it anyways, it's even in the documentation
03:08:05 <TimClark> what if you launch chrome and 3 other apps from the menue, then close chrome, are you saying will will hang around in the background for 20 minutes waiting for the menu to close
03:08:23 <Gizmokid2005> Computator: do you have Chrome installed?
03:08:25 <TimClark> that makes no snese
03:08:27 <Gizmokid2005> I mean, the portable version
03:09:16 <Computator> exactly, the Chrome portable launcher starts chrome itself ...
03:09:53 <Computator> and when chrome closes the launcher stays running in the background...
03:10:18 <TimClark> that is the laucher , NOT the menu/pap
03:10:22 <Computator> when the PAL exits the chrome launcher then cleans up
03:10:29 <Gizmokid2005> Computator: no
03:10:38 <Gizmokid2005> The launcher waits for Chrome to exit...then does its' cleanup
03:10:39 <Computator> it does that so chrome can start up quicker
03:10:40 <Gizmokid2005> then closes.
03:11:44 <Computator> yes, but (configurable by the ini of course) it waits for the PAL to exit so it can start up later more quickly rather than having to recopy files
03:11:54 <Computator> and yes i do have chrome portable
03:12:04 <TimClark> what are you calling the "PAL"
03:12:21 <Computator> and yes, i just tried it, it works without the menu and just exits right away
03:12:43 <Computator> the Portableapps menu/launcher that you can choose all the apps from
03:12:49 <TimClark> there is the portableapps menu/PAP, the chromeportable launcher, and chrome itself
03:12:57 <Computator> yeah
03:13:12 <TimClark> don't call it the launcer, call it the Menu or the PAP
03:13:27 <Computator> PAP is what i meant, i have heard people say PAP, PAL, and PAM
03:13:28 <TimClark> the laucher is part of portable chrome
03:13:37 <Computator> so which is the official one?
03:13:39 <Computator> yeah
03:13:40 <TimClark> PAL is really wrong
03:13:44 <Computator> ok
03:13:44 <TimClark> PAP
03:13:53 <Computator> ok i'll use that then
03:13:55 <TimClark> some times "The Menu"
03:14:42 <TimClark> PAL is the name of a generic launcher which is configured to be come the laucher for a certain app
03:14:51 <Computator> ahhh ok
03:15:01 <TimClark> it then becomes know as the XYZportable launcher
03:15:17 <Computator> they have some of the names too close :)
03:15:19 <Computator> yeah
03:15:24 <TimClark> yes, i agree
03:16:01 <TimClark> but anyway, the only point i want to make clear is that none of the apps require the PAP/MENU
03:16:32 <Computator> no, chrome doesn't (just tested)
03:16:42 <Computator> but it will wait for it if it is running
03:16:51 <Computator> looking for that part in the docs
03:16:56 <Gizmokid2005> Computator: find it in the docs
03:16:59 <Gizmokid2005> and do me a favor
03:17:04 <Gizmokid2005> put the launcher source on pastebin
03:17:07 <Gizmokid2005> and send it to me
03:17:12 <TimClark> "what" will wait for "what" , use words
03:17:26 <Gizmokid2005> I'm on my mac and still don't have the "latest" version of GC on my pa install
03:17:27 <Computator> wait for the PAP
03:17:34 <TimClark> nope
03:17:55 <TimClark> the chromelauncher will wait for chrome to close
03:18:04 <TimClark> the menu is not involved
03:18:11 <Computator> yes, but also the PAP
03:18:24 <TimClark> nope, if it does, something is wrong
03:18:31 <TimClark> or has changed
03:18:39 <TimClark> Gizmokid2005: do you know of any change
03:18:58 <Gizmokid2005> TimClark: not that I know of..
03:19:34 <TimClark> if portable chrome will run w/o the menu, why would it be waiting for the menue to close before shutting down
03:20:27 <Computator> :P my dad just said i have to get off the computer NOW :P i'm not trying to get out of explaining this
03:20:36 <Computator> i will explain tomorrow though
03:20:37 <TimClark> take care
03:20:39 <Gizmokid2005> TimClark: I can't see that being a requirement.
03:20:40 <Gizmokid2005> bye Computator
03:20:48 <Computator> ok you too :)
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03:39:17 <ZachThibeau> howdy TimClark
03:41:22 <TimClark> hello ZachThibeau , i'm not really here at the moment, how are you?
03:41:50 <ZachThibeau> tired about about to not be here in a moment :P other than that, I'm finally going for my drivers license
03:42:33 <TimClark> good for you, drive carefully
03:43:01 <ZachThibeau> sure thing and thanks
03:43:27 <TimClark> you will now be known as ZachThibeau Portable
03:43:45 <ZachThibeau> lol
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04:19:08 <GizmoBot> Bensawsome is from the PortableApps.com forums, likes waffles VERY MUCH, and has a site at http://www.bensawsome.com . He also maintains StatBot and the IRCStats pages @ http://www.ircstats.info
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05:20:24 <GizmoBot> ChrisMorgan is a PortableApps.com developer and moderator and works on the PortableApps.com Launcher (please test it!)
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05:59:46 <GizmoBot> computerfreaker is working on KidSafe and TopOCR, and would very much like to have folks test them and give feedback
06:01:39 <ChrisMorgan> Hey computerfreaker
06:01:48 <computerfreaker> Hi ChrisMorgan!
06:02:04 <computerfreaker> how's it going?
06:02:13 <ChrisMorgan> Fine
06:02:58 <ChrisMorgan> Have you used PAL 1a4 yet?
06:03:08 <computerfreaker> not yet
06:03:21 <computerfreaker> I'm planning to use it when I bring out KidSafe 0.25.6.0, though
06:03:29 <ChrisMorgan> OK
06:03:43 <ChrisMorgan> I should do the latest version of Data Crow with it now.
06:03:58 <computerfreaker> it'll probably be a few days more; until then, I'm concentrating on school work & the math problems DB
06:04:23 <computerfreaker> although I do have one newer app I'm working on, entirely coded in NSIS
06:04:37 <computerfreaker> mind if I use parts of PAL 1a3 in my NSIS code?
06:04:39 <ChrisMorgan> What is it?
06:05:11 <ChrisMorgan> I can't work out quite why you want gnome-panel-launcher for it... and have you considered the licensing of that?
06:05:32 <computerfreaker> the ${ForEachINIPair} macro and the ${ParseLocations} macro
06:05:55 <computerfreaker> and I don't need that Ubuntu icon anymore - I picked a new name and a new, mildly weird, icon
06:06:13 <ChrisMorgan> Oh dear. What is your thing though?
06:06:38 <computerfreaker> a general launcher, INI-based. You put in a list of files/folders to launch and it launches each of them
06:06:57 <computerfreaker> got a request from varxtis via e-mail, and this is where it led me
06:07:36 <computerfreaker> no cleanup, nothing fancy like PAL - essentially autorun.inf with the ability to run multiple apps/files
06:07:53 <ChrisMorgan> Why INI-based? What does that benefit? Wouldn't it be simpler just to have a list of files line by line?
06:08:26 <computerfreaker> yes, but I haven't been able to get that working
06:08:36 <ChrisMorgan> Why not?
06:08:52 <ChrisMorgan> FileOpen $0 apps.txt
06:08:56 <computerfreaker> not sure what call(s) I'd need, especially for something like ${ForEachINIPair}
06:09:17 <computerfreaker> Although in this case, it would be "read a line, execute. read a line, execute. Continue until EOF"
06:09:33 <computerfreaker> hmm, maybe I can do something with that. Let me look at the NSIS docs (still a relative newb)
06:09:57 <computerfreaker> oh, here we go: FileRead reads until a carriage return
06:10:19 <ChrisMorgan> Yeah, very simple
06:10:54 <computerfreaker> yes, you're right, and it's much simpler than my current setup
06:11:06 <computerfreaker> mind if I use ${ParseLocations}, though? That would be very useful
06:11:44 <ChrisMorgan> You'll want to use ${TrimNewLines} though; FileRead includes the CR
06:11:55 <computerfreaker> thanks for the tip!
06:12:17 <ChrisMorgan> TrimNewLines is TextFunc.nsh I think (so !include that)
06:12:33 <ChrisMorgan> I'd just set some environment variables that might be useful and then ExpandEnvStrings
06:13:46 <computerfreaker> instead of ${ParseLocations}, you mean?
06:14:46 <ChrisMorgan> Yep
06:15:50 <computerfreaker> I'll see what I can work out. This should be pretty interesting!
06:15:53 <computerfreaker> Thanks for the advice!
06:17:35 <ChrisMorgan> Something like http://chrismorgan.pastebin.com/d2ba44876 (entirely untested, haven't tried compiling it)
06:18:03 <ChrisMorgan> The ${GetRoot} $0 should have been ${GetRoot} $EXEDIR $0
06:18:19 <ChrisMorgan> You see what I'm doing with the environment variable bit though
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06:19:20 <computerfreaker> not completely, no
06:23:31 <ChrisMorgan> It's just setting an environment variable - Drive in this case - and then in each line of launch.txt you'll be able to have things like "%Drive%\PortableApps\Foo\foo.exe" and %Drive% will be expanded to X:
06:24:17 <computerfreaker> ok, I think I understand now. Thanks!
06:24:26 <computerfreaker> the basics are done; time to try the env vars
06:25:22 <ChrisMorgan> Variables like %APPDATA% will also be available due to ExpandEnvStrings
06:26:56 <ChrisMorgan> Due to using Exec you could also do something like "%Drive%\PortableApps\Foo\foo.exe" --data-dir="%Drive%\PortableApps\Foo\Data"
06:27:39 <ChrisMorgan> One minor caveat; on Windows 95, 98 and Me the path must be quoted if it has strings. 2000 and later are generally intelligent enough to work out what you meant.
06:27:52 <computerfreaker> interesting idea with Exec; I'll see what I can do with that
06:28:29 <computerfreaker> not sure about 2000 and later being "intelligent" - just typed %ALLUSERSPROFILE% into the command-line and most of it got cut off from a space.
06:28:42 <computerfreaker> I'll quote paths, just to be on the safe side
06:29:39 <ChrisMorgan> computerfreaker: that's a path - not an exec string
06:29:48 <ChrisMorgan> Exec uses some method which is supposed to be more intelligent
06:29:54 <computerfreaker> oh, ok
06:29:58 <ChrisMorgan> The problem is that it's fairly difficult to work out what should be quoted.
06:30:18 <computerfreaker> I'll quote paths, just to be safe
06:30:43 <ChrisMorgan> Don't just put quotes around the whole thing though - unless you want to break command line arguments
06:31:19 <ChrisMorgan> You could also go for a format [Launch1] Executable=, Arguments=[, WorkingDirectory=], [Launch2], ..
06:31:53 <ChrisMorgan> Then just quote Executable - Exec `"$1" $2`
06:32:22 <ChrisMorgan> The user really needs to know how to do the quotes, or you need to pull apart their command line, analyse each chunk and decide whether it should be quoted, etc. and still run the risk of making a mistake in the arguments.
06:33:27 <computerfreaker> more inclined to go INI-based, but that's just me
06:35:04 <computerfreaker> although, at some point, the usefulness of the general launcher is likely to drop - beyond a certain point, users should be using PAL themselves
06:35:39 <computerfreaker> so I'll just stick with what's going on now - one app per line, users quote things
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07:03:08 <computerfreaker> mind if I use ${StrReplace}?
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07:48:46 <computerfreaker> ChrisMorgan: mind if I use ${StrReplace}?
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09:02:50 <pa_9584> Do I have to install some middleware to use portable applications?
09:03:42 <pa_9584> I mean some middleware on my portable device (flash drive)
09:08:13 <pa_9584> hello! Is anybody here????????????????
09:11:21 <ChrisMorgan> pa_9584: what do you mean by middleware?
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09:12:48 <ChrisMorgan> The applications are stand-alone. If you want to, you can use the PortableApps.com Platform to launch them, but this is not mandatory.
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12:57:43 <markomlm> JohnTHalle:Welcome!
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12:58:02 <JohnTHaller> i'm only here for a minute, rough day
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13:34:56 <PatrickPatience> What am I what now?
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15:32:02 <fcf_user5319> When are you guys going to add a to top and to bottom button to your program?]
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17:51:37 <marlop> gluxon: do you have an idea of when eclipse will go official ?
17:52:47 <gluxon> Marlop: No sorry :'(
17:52:57 <gluxon> I would like it official just as much as you :P
17:53:30 <gluxon> The problem holding it back is subversion, which I find weird since nobody uses it :P
17:53:41 <gluxon> And it's a custom plugin. :/
17:54:43 <marlop> all the subversion plugins or one specifically ?
17:56:11 <gluxon> All :(
17:56:26 <gluxon> Well, actually, depends on how the developers design it.
17:56:44 <gluxon> subclipse is the only subversion handler for eclipse as far as I know.
17:57:02 <gluxon> And you can't change it's settings path.
17:57:43 <gluxon> And I can't do the regular backup, and restore like firefox since a lot of subversion clients use the folder.
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18:11:50 <GizmoBot> ...
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18:41:42 *** SteveLamerton (~kvirc@host-137-205-68-076.res.warwick.ac.uk) has joined #portableapps
18:43:44 <SteveLamerton> Hello all!
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18:53:29 <MaienM|Sleep> hello SteveLamerton, all
18:53:32 *** MaienM|Sleep is now known as MaienM
18:53:46 <SteveLamerton> Hi MaienM
18:59:20 <Gizmokid2005> hello MaienM
18:59:22 <Gizmokid2005> and SteveLamerton
18:59:48 <SteveLamerton> Hi Gizmokid2005
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19:21:43 <ZachThibeau> howdy SteveLamerton
19:21:51 <SteveLamerton> Heya ZachThibeau
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20:26:43 <pa_4938> i really like your log bot. anywhere I can get a dll version?
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20:28:06 <ZachThibeau> pa_4938: it isn't a plugin it's a program written in python and google loggy.py (warning though it comes with no documentation)
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20:29:44 <gluxon> How come they always leave without a word? :P
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20:32:14 <marlop> gluxon: hello
20:32:53 <gluxon> lol :P
20:34:23
20:34:41 *** Alcasar (~40125748@gateway/web/freenode/x-lzkxliintmzvvlzo) has joined #portableapps
20:35:33 <Alcasar> when ever i open a .doc with openofficeportable it gives me 2 errors about a script "terminologie"
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20:36:19 <marlop> Alcasar: did you install any addon ?
20:36:39 <Alcasar> yes
20:37:15 <Alcasar> french dictionary and others
20:37:33 <marlop> try disabling them, close openoffice and try again
20:38:07 <Alcasar> are you saying that the addons don't work with the portable version?
20:38:55 <marlop> no, i'm saying that one of the addons may have a bug
20:39:23 <marlop> or have been corrupted
20:43:17 <Alcasar> ok so i should re-install them
20:45:12 <marlop> yes, uninstall and install again
20:45:59 <marlop> but before, can you give me the error message that it gives
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20:51:32 <marlop> Alcasar: finished, any error ?
20:53:10 <Alcasar> no coz the problem happens on another computer
20:53:23 <Alcasar> i can't try it here now
20:56:23 <marlop> ok
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20:59:36 <Alcasar> Is there a reason why portable apps would act deferently when used from a folder on a hard drive instead of from a usb drive?
21:01:51 <marlop> most apps not
21:02:37 <Alcasar> how about ff
21:02:49 <marlop> but addons sometimes don't work portably, or leave stuff behind
21:03:08 <marlop> ex ?
21:03:21 <Alcasar> the "stuff" is not the problem it's the bugs
21:03:47 <Alcasar> when i use ff portable at home after a while it starts using all the cpu
21:04:11 <Alcasar> but it doesn't bug when i don't use the ffportable loader
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21:06:46 <gluxon> If you don't use the launcher (FirefoxPortable.exe) then settings get left behind and thus, it's no different than running a regular version.
21:06:49 <Alcasar> the only other difference between now "where ff is working properly and portably from my usb key" and at home where it bugs is that it's connected to the web
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21:08:38 <marlop> maybe a addon problem too(bugs on the addon)
21:11:41 <marlop> but to be sure, try a clean install on both and see if it happens to,
21:13:38 <marlop> if yes this may be a ff bug or a bug on the launcher, so if this happens with the clean install report it as a bug here: http://portableapps.com/forums/support/firefox_portable
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21:47:32 <SteveLamerton> Wow, I have managed to hit the Windows thread limit, oops
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21:48:09 <pa_1227> hey
21:48:15 <pa_1227> is there an admin here ?
21:50:26 <SteveLamerton> pa_1227: What can we do for you?
21:50:48 <pa_1227> i wish to speak about skype portable on forums
21:50:48 <SteveLamerton> Although note I am just a moderator and developer, the sole admin isn't here right now
21:51:01 <pa_1227> no subforum about it
21:51:33 <SteveLamerton> pa_1227: The best place to go is the Other Apps sub-forum, I believe plans are in place for a reorganisation in the future but that is where you should go for now
21:52:49 <pa_1227> ok tks i'm going to now on it
21:52:51 <pa_1227> cya
21:53:23 <SteveLamerton> Bye
21:53:58 <pa_1227> :)
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22:40:07 <excid3> Oni-Neoxes: reporting for duty
22:40:31 <Oni-Neoxes> Lets talk in -ot if you don't mind
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22:59:42 <pa_5668> can i make my portableapps suite startup automatically when my usb is plugged in?
23:01:54 <Oni-Neoxes> Yes pa_5668 but there is a kick to it. You have to install this and have it running at all times : http://portableapps.com/node/13770
23:02:28 <pa_5668> i wont work if it is not installed ?
23:02:37 <pa_5668> tht prog
23:02:45 <Oni-Neoxes> well
23:02:53 <Oni-Neoxes> it doesn't need installing by the looks of it
23:02:59 <Oni-Neoxes> It's just an exe you can run
23:03:32 <Oni-Neoxes> so you can probably take the nongui version and stick it the startup to have it go on startup.
23:04:30 <pa_5668> thank you for the help
23:04:47 <Oni-Neoxes> No Problem.
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23:46:10 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is awsome and is currently working on a super cool media player called musicplay3000 aka mp3k
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