IRC Log from 2010-05-16
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00:44:09 <pa_8821> hi
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00:51:16 <pa_9261> if pa_8821 would stay for more than a minute someone might actually reply to him :P
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02:03:26 <GizmoBot> ...
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05:51:32 <pa_1561> Hi why is nothing happening since April
05:51:38 <pa_1561> did something happen
05:51:58 <pa_1561> no updates anymore
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12:25:13 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
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14:09:55 <GizmoBot> MaienM is MaienM. He is the developer of The Mana World Portable, and he has a website at http://mmfail.co.cc/
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16:22:37 <mastersrp> This question has probably been asked a gazillion times before. Linux?
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16:41:09 <TimClark> mastersrp: What IS your question?
16:41:37 <mastersrp> PortableApps.com for Linux anyone?
16:41:55 <mastersrp> I'm only aware of a Windows client.
16:42:09 <mastersrp> So my question is basically.. Will there be?
16:42:14 <TimClark> our apps are windows apps, but they do run under WINE in *nix
16:43:16 <TimClark> So, the odds are no, because it would have to be two versions, one for windows, one for *nix [and then they will want one for MAC of course}
16:43:49 <mastersrp> The "odds" are no? So that means there's no certainity on this?
16:43:55 <TimClark> since both *nix and MAC can run WINE it seems like it would not be needed
16:44:16 <TimClark> So the question would be, who has the time and inclination
16:44:41 <TimClark> I would say it is not going to happen, but who knows the future?
16:45:15 <mastersrp> Well, I have the time but not the experience to do so. But having PortableApps.com for Linux would be pretty awesome.
16:45:28 <TimClark> Do you not use WINE
16:45:46 <mastersrp> I've tried running it under WINE, which didn't turn out very well.
16:46:03 <mastersrp> A native client would most likely work much better.
16:46:27 <TimClark> That would best be written by *nix folks, don't you think?
16:46:55 <mastersrp> Indeed, but not all Windows users are Windows ONLY users :]
16:47:24 <TimClark> True, but then they can use WINE, some of our members do and a happy with it
16:47:41 <mastersrp> The problem is that it doesn't run well on WINE, at least not for me.
16:47:57 <mastersrp> I myself have a copy of Windows 7 installed and a Linux distro as well. This means that I have to boot into Windows 7 to access most of my stuff from the Portable Apps.
16:48:02 <TimClark> It's a matter of time, skill [in 2 or three OSs] and resoruces
16:49:03 <TimClark> But in the future, who knows what could happen
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16:49:28 <mastersrp> Well, with Steam comming to Linux, and now being on both the PC and the Mac, maybe things will change for Linux.
16:50:01 <TimClark> Only Time will tell
16:51:11 <mastersrp> If a native Linux client were to show up, would a "linux" section be possible?
16:51:50 <TimClark> Not sure I understand
16:52:43 <mastersrp> Well, if someone managed to do a linux client with possibly some linux portable apps, would it be possible that a linux section would be made on the website?
16:53:46 <TimClark> I we made our apps work under5 *nix, ALL the apps would have to have a *nix version and so would be listed on the current pages
16:53:53 <TimClark> If we *
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16:55:00 <mastersrp> I see.. That *could* take some time.
16:57:38 <MaienM> that would likely be a project totally separate from the current PA.c seeing how EVERYTHING would have to be redone from scratch
16:57:40 <TimClark> The problem is that the number of folks who use *nix only is very small
16:58:05 <MaienM> it would be a very large task, and there probably is a very small section of people who would find it useful
16:59:00 <mastersrp> While that remains true, with the comming of the Steam linux client (commercial games for Linux) more people are likely to move to linux.
16:59:16 <MaienM> most of which are probably tech-savvy enough to be able to rsync or whatever the config files of 90% of their programs anyway, so for whom it would be more utility anyway
16:59:21 <TimClark> you really belive that MaienM ?
16:59:50 <MaienM> as much as I applaud your optimism, I doubt that linux as a mainstream/gaming platform is something that is going to happen soon
16:59:52 <TimClark> you really belive that mastersrp /correction/*
17:00:04 <TimClark> [tab fail]
17:00:14 <MaienM> I can't think of any big game/commercial game that runs on linux
17:00:31 <MaienM> nor of any company that announced any plans to start game development for linux
17:00:49 <mastersrp> All of Valve's Source(tm) engine games are being ported to the Linux platform.
17:01:03 <mastersrp> I'll dig up the source for you.
17:01:10 <MaienM> really? I didn't know that
17:01:10 <TimClark> not need
17:01:33 <MaienM> that certainly is a step in the right direction, but I still doubt many people will move to linux
17:01:43 <TimClark> current usage world wide is Linux (1.15%) I doubt it will change THAT much
17:01:55 <mastersrp> "many" is a relative term.
17:01:57 <MaienM> for most people there just isn't any need to move away from windows, which they know and are familiar with
17:02:04 <MaienM> it certainly is
17:02:08 <mastersrp> For most people, that remains true.
17:02:19 <mastersrp> But "many" are only stuck on Windows because of the game thing.
17:02:41 <MaienM> either way, I doubt the market share of linux (as much as I like it, I'm a linux user myself) is going to become considerable any time soon
17:02:43 <Gizmokid2005> mastersrp: with the game thing, many people play games that will probably /never/ come to linux. IE - COD series, NFS series, etc.
17:02:56 <Gizmokid2005> there's a lot of games that don't go through the steam environment
17:03:18 <mastersrp> That's true, but there's also -quite- a bunch that does.
17:03:18 <TimClark> i DOUBT the vast majority of Windows users know what *nix is
17:03:36 <mastersrp> The vast majority of computer users haven't ever heard about *nix.
17:03:43 <TimClark> They DO know what a MAC is at least
17:04:09 <TimClark> and even that usage share is Mac OS X (6.15%)
17:04:58 <mastersrp> I'm not saying that the usage or market share is going to boom up for the linux platform when steam comes. But there's going to be a visible change.
17:05:00 <TimClark> and of both the *nix and MAC users , they CAN use WINE, so the call is really small
17:05:05 <MaienM> anyway, to sum it up, it is very unlikely that there are going to be any portable applications for linux anytime soon
17:05:48 <Gizmokid2005> mastersrp: it's actually doubtful, because like you said yourself, you have Linux and windows. Most users that game already and use linux, use linux principally...and just use Windows as a secondary solution to gaming...I doubt that number will change more than a percentage point, if that much.
17:05:52 <MaienM> even if the market share of linux doubles, it is still hardly worth considering
17:06:13 <mastersrp> Haha, yes, that's true. I'm just hoping, and waiting for the Steam linux client release. Hopefully it'll change "something" in the comming years.
17:06:17 <MaienM> and most of our developers are on windows and have little interest in creating linux software
17:07:09 <MaienM> I'm hoping the same mastersrp, but as it stands portable software for linux is far, far away
17:07:17 <mastersrp> With "in the comming years", i mean 5-10 years in the future.
17:08:02 <TimClark> It should be pointed out mastersrp that MaienM "IS" Linux user btw
17:08:04 <MaienM> I don't think speculating about what could happen in the next decade is relevant to what you asked ;)
17:08:21 <MaienM> yes, it COULD, at some point in the future, become viable
17:08:39 <MaienM> but at the moment it is not and as such pa.c for linux is not going to happen any time soon
17:08:53 <mastersrp> Not unless someone does it for you, that is.
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18:23:41 <sar3th> <mastersrp> But "many" are only stuck on Windows because of the game thing. <-- i agree, even though my comment is way too late ;)
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18:58:51 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
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19:00:02 <pa_6527> ******
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19:05:43 <pa_0951> i need help
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19:06:23 <sar3th> pa_0951: please ask your question
19:06:25 <sar3th> >_<
19:06:28 <kai_62656> ...
19:06:44 <sar3th> pa_0825: need help? please ask your question!
19:07:16 <pa_0825> i'm fine
19:07:24 <kai_62656> ok
19:07:32 <kai_62656> just *hanging* around? :P
19:07:33 <sar3th> good :)
19:08:02 <pa_0825> are you a developer
19:08:08 <kai_62656> not me
19:08:50 <sar3th> yes, i have developed some launchers for portableapps
19:09:22 <pa_0825> which ones
19:09:38 <sar3th> SublimeText Portable and MinGW Portable
19:10:29 <pa_0825> i don't see them on the list
19:10:32 <ZachThibeau> and I'm the author of PChat as well as PChat Portable
19:33:34 <pa_0825> i don't think i would really have a need for mingw or sublimetext really
19:34:37 <pa_0825> and pchat seems to be basically xchat
19:38:25 <ZachThibeau> well PChat is a fork of XChat
19:38:30 <ZachThibeau> it says right in the description
19:39:02 <pa_0825> so i don't get the point
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19:40:51 <ZachThibeau> the point is this, XChat mostly the windows build is chuck full of gpl violations, my fork is to continue the tradition of the GPL license and to try be better than XChat, it's not there yet but it's a work in progress
19:42:07 <pa_0825> i'm sorry what is a gpl violation
19:43:11 <ZachThibeau> gpl is a license that most open-source apps use, a violation is something like changing the source from the original and not releasing the changes to the public
19:43:58 <ZachThibeau> in this case the original dev of XChat made the windows version shareware, refusing to release patches to obtain the use of minigtk, and also the use of spell check
19:44:57 <ZachThibeau> while the *nix port is free the main violation is in how he coded the shareware code into the windows build forcing it to use a shareware license
19:46:28 <pa_0825> so xchat for windows was open source and now is not, but the linux version is still open source
19:47:21 <ZachThibeau> yes it was open source at one point for the windows build and yes linux version is still open-source
19:48:41 <pa_0825> but is it bad that it is shareware, portable apps has shareware apps now i think and one of sar3th apps is shareware
19:49:13 <pa_0825> the mingw one i think
19:50:02 <ZachThibeau> well in my case the source for the linux version is still available, I was able to make necessary adjustments to make my fork and no mingw is gpl :P
19:50:12 <ZachThibeau> it's the other one if I recall
19:56:17 <sar3th> pa_0825: mingw is free software, sublime text is not (that's why i only released the launcher for that)
19:57:38 <pa_0825> sorry sar3th , ZachThibeau pointed out that i had mentioned the wrong one
19:57:55 <sar3th> no problem :)
19:58:10 <pa_0825> i have no problem with shareware myself
19:58:45 <sar3th> M;)
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19:59:13 <pa_0825> i have no problem with software that is not open source for that matter, i just like free :P
20:00:01 <sar3th> yes, i do as well, that's why i'm using notepad++ and netbeans instead of sublime, but i thought people might find it useful :)
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20:01:46 <pa_0825> is anyone here reading the posts at portableapps.com right now
20:02:19 <sar3th> not really :/
20:02:30 <sar3th> if you want me to read something, you got to post the link here ;)
20:02:31 <pa_0825> i don't think that solanus is being fair
20:02:44 <ZachThibeau> nah I'm coding some stuff in PChat atm
20:02:45 <pa_0825> let me try
20:03:36 <pa_0825> http://portableapps.com/user/2241
20:03:42 <pa_0825> no that's not it
20:04:15 <pa_0825> ...?
20:04:16 <pa_0825> no not that
20:04:54 <pa_0825> http://portableapps.com/node/23495#comment-149519
20:04:54 <pa_0825> i hope i got that right
20:05:26 <pa_0825> saying that something is on a list is not the same as saying it is being dealt with
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21:59:41 <Gizmokid2005> pa_0825: nothing on that list is really being dealt with
21:59:55 <Gizmokid2005> John has the final say
21:59:58 <Gizmokid2005> and he's not budging
22:00:26 <Gizmokid2005> he's been saying "That way we don't have to re-release them a week later to keep them in sync." for over a month now.
22:00:26 <pa_0825> i guess you mean my last comment
22:01:16 <pa_0825> but don't the origianl apps update all the time
22:01:33 <Gizmokid2005> not all of them, but most, yes.
22:02:13 <Gizmokid2005> as an "interim" solution, /most/ apps can be updated by installing them locally and copying the app's files over, but not all users can do that, and it's a pretty bad "workaround"
22:02:44 <pa_0825> so you update the ones that are ready now and when they update again you use the new format or installer or whatever is holding things up
22:03:27 <Gizmokid2005> Yep, you should. like I said, it's John's call though.
22:03:28 <pa_0825> i don't see why it's a problem
22:03:33 <Gizmokid2005> he's the only one who can release them.
22:03:54 <sar3th> we are not authorized to make that decision pa_0825
22:04:39 <pa_0825> some are over a month old, by the time they come out unless it's tomorrow, it will be time to update again :(
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22:30:45 <pa_8766> Hola
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22:31:23 <sar3th> hello JacobMastel
22:31:46 <JacobMastel> How's things going sar3th?
22:31:56 <sar3th> good, thanks
22:32:07 <sar3th> u?
22:32:36 <JacobMastel> Alright...redoing stickies portable to fit in with Chris' Pal launcher
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22:33:01 <JacobMastel> That and trying to figure out how I'm going to deal with it's language switching...that's just giving me a headache.
22:33:08 <JacobMastel> *its
22:36:04 <sar3th> i don't think you are alone with that
22:50:21 <JacobMastel> with the language issues?
22:50:33 <JacobMastel> sorry about that lag I just got that message :/
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22:53:13 <sar3th> yes
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22:54:26 <JacobMastel> Yeah stickies just seems worse than others
22:55:02 <JacobMastel> You can download all the .zip's from his website, but it detects the lanaguage as english by default. Unless of course the .dll happens to be in the app folder.
22:55:22 <JacobMastel> The problem is no matter what the language is it's gotta be named language70.dll
22:55:28 <JacobMastel> So checking that is kinda a pain.
22:55:43 <JacobMastel> so I'll probably have every one of the .zip files and use 7za to command line copy it.
22:56:13 <JacobMastel> Maybe store the current language in an .ini file, and then check it against the pa.c platform .ini....
22:56:32 <sar3th> proly a good idea
22:57:00 <JacobMastel> What a pain :P
22:57:11 <JacobMastel> Anyone here play with Digsby before?
22:57:22 <JacobMastel> I'm using Miranda (and really don't like it)
22:57:35 <JacobMastel> The only thing that seems to be a bit of a drag is the lack of irc support.
22:59:00 <sar3th> i don't like digsby
22:59:18 <JacobMastel> Why?
22:59:36 <JacobMastel> I heard it got into the whole rob you of your cpu time for a while, but now you can remove it.
22:59:59 <sar3th> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digsby#Privacy_and_Other_Concerns
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23:01:10 <JacobMastel> 75%...
23:01:13 <JacobMastel> Wow
23:01:20 <JacobMastel> Never new it was quite that high.
23:01:45 <JacobMastel> Crap, back to square one to find an IM client... :P
23:01:58 <JacobMastel> Pidgin's ugly, and Miranda is a pain...
23:02:11 <rcmaehl> silverex chat rocks
23:02:16 <rcmaehl> aka y-chat
23:02:36 <JacobMastel> lol
23:02:47 <JacobMastel> they exceeded their bandwidth allocation :P
23:02:57 <rcmaehl> ?
23:03:02 <JacobMastel> rcmaehl: I'm looking for something that will also cover I'm chats
23:03:21 <rcmaehl> JacobMastel: a cellphone?
23:03:41 <JacobMastel> *im chats
23:03:53 <JacobMastel> No I clicked the link I pulled out of google and it said error.
23:03:54 <rcmaehl> skype?
23:03:58 <JacobMastel> On their side not mine
23:04:09 <JacobMastel> I'm on a standard connection :/
23:04:25 <JacobMastel> oh nvm that was their .hr site....
23:04:36 <JacobMastel> http://www.silverex.com.hr/
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23:20:43 <sar3th> anyone who is complaining about Delphi not supporting 64 Bit binaries, please read this article (or at least "The Compiler Back End" section!)
23:20:51 <sar3th> http://edn.embarcadero.com/article/39174
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