IRC Log from 2010-09-02
00:00:05 <ChrisMorgan> Eek... ConfigParser can't cope with UTF-16LE files, and nor can iniparse :-(
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00:43:33 <ChrisMorgan> Finally worked around it... UTF-16LE is not well supported. UTF-8 is so much better.
00:44:56 <sar3th> indeed
00:46:05 <ChrisMorgan> Python's codecs.open was doing fine turning UTF-16LE into UTF-8 for its own delectation, but it was leaving the bomb in and that makes RawConfigParser blow up :-(
00:46:28 <ChrisMorgan> And I have to cope with UTF-16LE /or/ ANSI.
00:49:01 <ChrisMorgan> AND John missed six of my seven locale fixes from 2.0 Beta 4 in 2.0 Beta 5 :-(
00:56:57 <ChrisMorgan> And LocaleName didn't get into Beta 5...
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01:28:27 <ChrisMorgan> Eek, dboki89 used non-latin characters in the Serbian LocaleCode2, LocaleCode3 and LanguageCode :-/
01:30:32 <ChrisMorgan> When I saw ср it looked just like cp to me - but it's not.
01:30:44 <ChrisMorgan> The first is Cyrillic letters, the second is Latin...
01:31:11 <ChrisMorgan> It was only when I thought "the n in 'срп' looks a bit funny" that I checked it.
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01:45:35 <GizmoBot> MaienM is MaienM. He is the developer of The Mana World Portable.
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02:17:17 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
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02:47:54 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
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10:19:01 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
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10:19:10 <GizmoBot> ...
10:32:44 <auscompgeek> ...
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12:14:20 <M4T1A5> oo new version of KeePass has been released
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12:20:57 * ChrisMorgan now has an XP VM set up for testing :-)
12:21:10 <Gringoloco> :)
12:21:26 <Gringoloco> Shouldn't you be a sleep ?
12:24:03 <ChrisMorgan> .t AEST
12:24:03 <GizmoBot> Thu, 02 Sep 2010 22:24:03 AEST
12:24:12 <ChrisMorgan> Soon but not yet.
12:25:14 <ZachThibeau> I wish I was asleep now lol but 9:24am I need to be awake :P
12:29:06 <Gringoloco> So you'll be able to run WinampP tomorrow :)
12:29:28 <ChrisMorgan> Should be able to.
12:29:59 <ChrisMorgan> Then the next steps are to set up VMs for Vista 32, Vista 64, 7 32, 7 64 and Server 2008 R2 32 and 64 and XP 64 if I get enthusiastic about it :-)
12:30:15 <ChrisMorgan> Then I'll have a *real* test environment, which will be very nice.
12:31:35 <ChrisMorgan> And maybe some flavour of Linux for Wine 1.0
12:31:39 <ChrisMorgan> And 1.1
12:32:14 <Gringoloco> ChrisMorgan: You never fixed the issue with the temp folder being deleted on every run (secondary run)
12:32:14 <ZachThibeau> don't forget 1.2 or 1.3
12:32:53 <ChrisMorgan> ZachThibeau: I've got 1.2 on the host. And 1.3 doesn't exist yet as something I can build.
12:33:25 <ZachThibeau> actually I should say 1.3.1 and alright
12:33:44 <Gringoloco> Ah oh yes, I think you did, sorry
12:34:25 <ChrisMorgan> Gringoloco: I was just about to open it up and check - I'm pretty sure I did
12:34:31 <ChrisMorgan> ZachThibeau: 1.3.1?
12:35:40 <ZachThibeau> yeah wine 1.3.1 was released a little while ago
12:35:48 <ZachThibeau> http://www.winehq.org/announce/1.3.1
12:36:56 <ChrisMorgan> Interesting. The 1.3 line is looking very promising.
12:37:41 <ZachThibeau> it most certainly does indeed
12:38:16 <ChrisMorgan> "New builtin wscript.exe (Windows Script Host) program." I did actually quite seriously consider JavaScript as a language PAL could be rewritten in a month or so ago - but Wine didn't have the WSH so that wouldn't work.
12:39:13 <ChrisMorgan> And the cross-process OLE drag & drop... whoa! X11 <-> OLE drag & drop... WHOA!
12:41:04 <ZachThibeau> you sound excited :P
12:42:32 <ChrisMorgan> ZachThibeau: what language would you write PAL in if you were doing it? Constraints: small executables (<200KB), easy custom code (meaning neither the code nor the compilation may be too hard)
12:43:26 <ChrisMorgan> NSIS is really sub-optimal in a lot of things. I just wish I could do it in Python - but there's no solid way of generating small executables (which will work without the Python runtime).
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12:44:40 <ZachThibeau> personally I would like to use c without any gui classes, imho it's possible and without the gui classes it could be small too
12:45:31 <ChrisMorgan> How small could a compiler package be made for it, though? The NSIS compiler can be stripped to only 2-3MB, and easily invoked, too.
12:46:19 <ChrisMorgan> And C would not be conducive for neat or easy custom code for anyone who didn't already know C.
12:46:21 <ZachThibeau> well one could use mingw but just include gcc and only the required library's and thats all
12:46:31 <ZachThibeau> and true
12:47:52 <ChrisMorgan> I've thought of C/C++ myself, and decided probably the biggest problem with it is that none of the PAL development team (plus John) is /really/ familiar with it. Gringoloco has the most experience in it - which started with converting ANSI NSIS plugins to Unicode. It'd be a language to learn first...
12:48:10 <ChrisMorgan> I think we'll be staying with NSIS for at least a long time.
12:54:04 <ZachThibeau> well the thing about c/c++ you could write a small script interpreter for the custom code portion, maybe a little more time consuming but I think it would work if it was done properly
12:55:59 <ZachThibeau> lol we could try using asm xD
12:57:59 <ZachThibeau> I have a friend that can do crazy stuff with just asm :P
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13:06:39 <ChrisMorgan> I did think of assembly code. But I didn't really consider it an option. It would be fast if done well... :P
13:07:28 <ChrisMorgan> 1 update for my new XP VM, then 77, wonder how many more after that.
13:07:47 <ZachThibeau> lol I know what you mean
13:07:54 <MaienM> C++ would probably be a speed/effencienty increase compared to NSIS :P
13:08:43 <MaienM> it really isn't THAT hard to learn though
13:10:09 <ZachThibeau> well let's make a c++ pal and do a comparison
13:11:04 <ZachThibeau> I'm willing to give it a go :P
13:14:20 <ChrisMorgan> With some of the trickier things you could copy large amounts of NSIS and NSIS plugin code and just cut out the NSIS references, change the use of stack, etc.
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13:16:12 <GizmoBot> MaienM is MaienM. He is the developer of The Mana World Portable.
13:24:54 <ZachThibeau> anyways got to go, house won't clean by itself
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13:45:04 <ChrisMorgan> All set up how I want it :-) Now I can go to bed.
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14:06:01 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
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15:56:52 <GizmoBot> computerfreaker is working on KidSafe and Iron Portable, and would very much like to have folks test them and give feedback.
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15:57:07 <GizmoBot> computerfreaker is working on KidSafe and Iron Portable, and would very much like to have folks test them and give feedback.
15:57:09 <GizmoBot> computerfreaker is working on KidSafe and Iron Portable, and would very much like to have folks test them and give feedback.
15:57:23 <computerfreaker> what the heck was that, GizmoBot?
15:58:29 <Computator> * computerfreaker (40c94702@gateway/web/freenode/ip.64.201.71.2) has joined #portableapps
15:58:29 <Computator> <GizmoBot> computerfreaker is working on KidSafe and Iron Portable, and would very much like to have folks test them and give feedback.
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15:58:32 <Computator> that's why
15:58:47 <Computator> you joined three times
15:59:04 <computerfreaker> Computator: you sure? I only joined once, as far as I know.
15:59:19 <Computator> you did, but it quit and changed hosts
15:59:27 <Computator> you can see from what i pasted
15:59:33 <Computator> (above)
15:59:35 <computerfreaker> Probably because I identified with NickServ after I joined?
15:59:39 <Computator> yup
15:59:54 <computerfreaker> Thanks for clearing that up
15:59:58 <Computator> yw :)
16:00:04 <computerfreaker> Note to self: identify *before* joining #portableapps next time
16:00:21 <Computator> hehe yup :)
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16:21:23 <pa_5740> Here's a link that might be interesting: http://www.portablelinuxapps.org/
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17:37:19 *** Delano (tute@iburst-41-213-23-253.iburst.co.za) has joined #portableapps
17:37:34 <Delano> I have a question about pchat; can anyone help?
17:39:13 <Computator> maybe, what is it?
17:39:43 <Delano> I'm using the Silverex build of xchat in Windows and I want to transfer my settings to pchat; how exactly does that work?
17:40:08 <Computator> hmmm.... i'm not sure on that one...
17:40:16 <Computator> someone else might know for sure
17:41:02 <Computator> but i think you would just copy xchat's settings files over the top of pchat's
17:41:28 <Delano> I'm not sure where to go. The folder structure are evidentally different
17:41:37 <Computator> ok, let me look...
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17:41:45 * Computator is using PChat atm
17:42:05 <pa_4526> anyone familiar with songbird portable?
17:42:55 <Computator> Delano: ok, pchat's data is in C:\Documents and Settings\[username]\Application Data\PChat
17:43:11 <Delano> pa_4526, they've discontinued it. It's a plugin for thunderbird called Lightning now
17:43:35 <Computator> Delano: and xchat's is in C:\Documents and Settings\[username]\Application Data\X-Chat 2
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17:43:45 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
17:43:49 <Computator> Delano: at least for me...
17:43:53 <Delano> Heh
17:43:57 <Delano> Talk of the devil
17:44:00 <Computator> oh, ask ZachThibeau
17:44:02 <Computator> :)
17:44:07 <Delano> ZachThibeau, I have a pchat question
17:45:48 <Delano> I guess he's away
17:45:52 <Computator> Delano: which version of windows btw?
17:45:58 <Delano> 7
17:46:34 <Computator> oh ok, than it would be the same except substitute c:\Users for c:\Documents and Settings
17:46:47 <Computator> (if i remember correctly)
17:47:10 <Delano> Yeah, D&S appears in 7 too :o)
17:47:17 <Computator> oh ok :)
17:47:18 <Delano> They try to hide it better, but it's there
17:47:30 <Computator> lol ok :)
17:47:48 <Delano> But if it writes settings there... that negative it being portable
17:47:53 <Delano> Does it not?
17:48:12 <Computator> ohhh, i forgot you are using the portable version
17:48:24 <Delano> Negates*
17:48:30 <Bensawsome> Delano rename the X-chat settings directory to PChat and copy into the settings folder of the portableapps
17:48:37 <Computator> i'm using the standard installable one...
17:48:45 <Bensawsome> that is how to replace it
17:48:46 <Computator> yeah, that's about what i meant
17:48:48 <Bensawsome> err
17:48:50 <Bensawsome> copy it in
17:49:07 <ZachThibeau> sorry Delano I was temporarily away, back though
17:49:11 <Delano> Bensawsome, ah ha, thanks
17:49:22 <Bensawsome> Delano if you need more specifics just ask
17:49:34 <Bensawsome> actually zach may have a guide on his site
17:49:36 * Bensawsome lewkz
17:50:00 <Computator> one other thing...
17:50:16 <Computator> you have to rename xchat.conf to pchat.conf
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17:51:25 <Bensawsome> oh ya that too Delano
17:51:55 <Computator> and idk if it is a problem or not but you may need to change the version line inside pchat.conf
17:52:06 <Computator> since it is different than xchat
17:52:18 <M4T1A5> when is my chrome portable 6 coming?
17:52:30 <Computator> yeah!!!
17:53:06 <ZachThibeau> shouldn't be a problem at all really
17:53:13 <Computator> ok
17:53:17 <Computator> i wan't sure
17:53:20 <Computator> wasn't*
17:53:33 <ZachThibeau> no worries
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17:54:13 <ZachThibeau> sorry I wasn't much help, I was finishing up some house work, anyways I'll stick around a bit and work on the pchat rewrite
17:54:14 <Delano-> What did you get last?
17:54:34 <Bensawsome> "Ah ha, thanks"
17:54:37 <Bensawsome> lol
17:54:58 <Delano-> <ZachThibeau> sorry Delano I was temporarily away, back though
17:54:59 <Delano-> <Delano> It's cool
17:54:59 <Delano-> <Delano> xtray is kinda annoying; is there any way to disable it, ZachThibeau?
17:54:59 <Delano-> <Delano> It's not a pchat problem. I've always found it annoying, in all xchat builds
17:55:43 <ZachThibeau> yeah I know but xtray is the only tray plugin that works at this moment, the built in gtk tray doesn't work at this moment
17:56:19 <Delano-> The Silverex build has an annoying bug where the tray doesn't save changes
17:56:26 <Delano-> A bug pchat seems to have inherited
17:56:30 <Computator> should i paste what you missed?
17:56:40 <Computator> or pmsg it?
17:56:44 <Delano-> Paste
17:56:48 <Computator> <Bensawsome> Delano if you need more specifics just ask
17:56:48 <Computator> <Bensawsome> actually zach may have a guide on his site
17:56:48 <Computator> * Bensawsome lewkz
17:56:48 <Computator> <Computator> one other thing...
17:56:48 <Computator> <Computator> you have to rename xchat.conf to pchat.conf
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17:56:51 <Computator> <Bensawsome> oh ya that too Delano
17:56:53 <Computator> <Computator> and idk if it is a problem or not but you may need to change the version line inside pchat.conf
17:56:56 <Computator> <Computator> since it is different than xchat
17:57:00 <Computator> <M4T1A5> when is my chrome portable 6 coming?
17:57:02 <Computator> <Computator> yeah!!!
17:57:04 <Computator> <ZachThibeau> shouldn't be a problem at all really
17:57:06 <Computator> <Computator> ok
17:57:08 <Computator> <Computator> i wan't sure
17:57:10 <Computator> <Computator> wasn't*
17:57:12 <Computator> <ZachThibeau> no worries
17:57:36 <Bensawsome> .....lol
17:57:49 <Computator> ?
17:58:05 <Bensawsome> SPAM Computator ;D
17:59:29 <M4T1A5> wtf is this spam
17:59:42 <M4T1A5> Computator: use pastebin
17:59:44 <Delano-> Sorry
17:59:48 <Delano-> I asked him to
17:59:51 <Delano-> Blame me
18:00:03 <M4T1A5> still could have enough brains to use pastebin
18:00:06 <M4T1A5> *should
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18:01:11 <ZachThibeau> Delano-: yeah it's a unicode issue, seems most third party xchat builds including mine has issues with unicode in xtray, I'm working on a rewrite of PChat in c++ to help not only in maintability but also to fix some issues in xchat that have been introduced by gtk itself
18:01:40 <Delano-> yeah, not relying on gtk itself is a blessing, ZachThibeau
18:02:24 <ZachThibeau> I wish I could use minigtk like the official xchat uses but zed the maintainer of xchat refuses to release the patches necessary to utilize minigtk
18:03:00 <Delano-> So he's making it a monopoly
18:03:06 <Delano-> I thought open source was different :o)
18:04:09 <Bensawsome> Delano- it is but zed is being incredibly douchebagish
18:04:13 <Bensawsome> lol
18:04:14 <ZachThibeau> well the core of xchat will remain the same the gui will be rewritten entirely, and this way less dll's needed to be used all 1 static binary
18:07:30 <Delano-> Good call
18:07:55 <ZachThibeau> and I'll be using wxwidgets for the gui so it will still be cross platformable so it will be usable on linux and osx as well
18:09:48 <Delano-> Sounds like zed is being a typical linux guy
18:10:00 <Delano-> Wants to make it difficult for folks to port to Windows
18:10:46 <Computator> hehe :)
18:10:46 <Computator> i asked first
18:11:46 <Computator> sorry :(
18:11:55 <ZachThibeau> well it's not that difficult to port to windows, he just likes to make it look hard, the only thing that get's me ticked off is that he purposely breaks minigtk and refuses to release his patches for minigtk and also for spell check :/
18:15:01 <ZachThibeau> so I'm doing the gui rewrite not only to keep PChat a fork but also to gain features that the official XChat client has such as spell check and also smiley support :P
18:15:41 <Delano-> Oh, there's an xchat bug I need to report; pchat probably inherits it
18:15:55 <Delano-> When I accept dcc from someone, it botches up filenames
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18:16:16 <GizmoBot> dbdii407 is Dave, Owner of the ScrapIRC Network.
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18:16:46 <Delano-> So much for anonymity
18:17:16 <ZachThibeau> it's PortableApps.com we have nothing to hide but our network addresses to our home computers :P
18:19:01 <Delano-> heh
18:19:03 <Delano-> Yeah
18:19:08 <Delano-> Yer a big happy family
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18:37:11 <Computator> hmmm, pchat must not be workin right
18:37:22 <Computator> i missed like half of what was said
18:37:27 <Computator> (comparing to log)
18:39:30 <ZachThibeau> you're only viewing a scroll back
18:39:54 <ZachThibeau> and when you quit pchat your own log's stops recording
18:40:04 <Computator> no i mean compared to http://nascent-project.org/irc/logs
18:41:15 <Computator> compare http://pastebin.com/yJvYCd7Y to the above
18:41:43 <Computator> it missed a whole section while i was connected
18:42:01 <Computator> and the disconnect locked it up btw
18:42:06 <Computator> but that was later
18:43:33 <Computator> 17:58:05 - 18:10:46 (times from nascent) is all missing
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20:00:02 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
20:18:48 <pa_5740> ZachThibeau: How's PChat Portable coming?
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20:55:16 <pa_4904> hi
21:00:23 <pa_4904> anyone out ther?
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