IRC Log from 2011-07-25

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00:56:33 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
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01:18:49 <pa_5346> Hello
01:19:05 <pa_5346> I saw the new version of the platform will have auto-updating.
01:19:24 <pa_5346> How is this done, and what will I have to change, as an app developer?
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02:26:27 <GizmoBot> GordCaswell is the developer of Armagetron Advanced Portable, Evince Portable & ZSoft Uninstaller Portable
02:27:13 <agdurrette> .seen agdurrette
02:27:14 <GizmoBot> agdurrette: I last saw agdurrette at 2011-07-25 02:27:13 UTC on #portableapps
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04:26:09 <kAlug> howdy ChrisMorgan
04:26:34 <ChrisMorgan> hey kAlug
04:28:38 <kAlug> Do you think PAL 2.1.1 is ready?
04:37:08 <ChrisMorgan> I believe so.
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05:20:51 <kAlug> ChrisMorgan: What would be the better way to handle multiple launcher.ini? Build all? Select in an extra page? Other alternatives?
05:21:14 <ChrisMorgan> kAlug: the problem is that there are several quite different approaches which could be desired.
05:22:29 <kAlug> Maybe something like http://portableapps.com/files/forumimages/platform2pr1/PortableAppDirectory.png ?
05:22:53 <ChrisMorgan> You can have one adding to another (extra environment variables or command line arguments or such), shared launcher functionality with some mutually exclusive differences (such as just some common data), et cetera.
05:23:54 <ChrisMorgan> I'm not in the slightest interested in implementing the UI in NSIS. I plan to merge the PortableApps.com Launcher Generator into the PortableApps.com Development Toolkit before getting round to sorting out what to do in these sorts of cases.
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10:32:20 <GizmoBot> GizmoBot is the official bot of #Gizmokid2005 and #PortableApps.
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11:08:28 <GizmoBot> auscompgeek is the oz geek, kthxbai.
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11:25:57 <GizmoBot> ...
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11:36:29 <GizmoBot> ZachThibeau is the main developer of PChat and is a developer with PortableApps.com
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13:55:34 <george2> .tell JohnTHaller Re: Bug "Updater IE Cache - The updater may leave app installers behind in the IE cache directory"-- If/when you do fix this, can you have setups download to the drive instead? I like having the installers stay there, and often copy them from the cache to my drive for later use.
13:55:34 <GizmoBot> george2: I'll pass that on when JohnTHaller is around.
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16:18:21 <cpp_dev-geo> I was wondering if anyone out there has had a good experience with Portable apps and Cloud Drive(s) of if someone could recommend one. I would need around 7G & ideally it would work very similar to a USB drive (ie files not stored on computer after drive is detatched)
16:20:11 <cpp_dev-geo> The reason I ask is my USB thumstick recently suffered from a catastrophic event. I live in a rural area and it will be awhile before I can get to where I can buy or order a quality drive to replace it. Was hoping to try a Cloud Drive in the interm.
16:23:41 <Gizmokid2005> cpp_dev-geo: really depends on the quality of your inetrnet connections
16:23:57 <Gizmokid2005> some apps can be quite large, and keeping a cloud drive storage system might be BW heavy.
16:24:11 <Gizmokid2005> what with most ISPs implementing BW caps now too.
16:25:24 <cpp_dev-geo> Where I use it most often (from work) the BW shouldn't be too much of an issue. @home might be, but I don't use it often from there.
16:25:54 <Gizmokid2005> I'd check into how exactly it's handled. If local copies are stored or if it's directly run from the web, or just a temp cache while it's being used, etc.
16:26:07 <Gizmokid2005> I killed too many flash drives myself and had to go to a 2.5" ext hdd to handle my load
16:27:37 <cpp_dev-geo> ext. hdd's tend to wear out and die on me too quickly. I guess I'm rough on them.
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16:28:09 <Gizmokid2005> I've been using this one for nearly 4 years now, but I did have to replace it once already, the USB port on it was wearing out.
16:28:24 <cpp_dev-geo> I'm not too bad with usb sticks... About 1 a year, maybe 1 every 6 months.
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16:29:39 <cpp_dev-geo> I was considering contacting John T to see if I could 'test' one of the PortableApps USB drives that they are working on.
16:30:24 <cpp_dev-geo> Since it's likely I'm going to have to order online or wait till my next big trip to a metropolis...
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16:32:12 <cpp_dev-geo> PortableApps are a signficant part of my day and has been very useful... But I'm sure most everyone here knows and agrees with that... :)
16:42:56 <Gizmokid2005> haha, no doubt
16:42:59 <Gizmokid2005> I'd love to have a branded drive
16:43:07 <Gizmokid2005> but I cannot use a flash drive, I will kill it.
16:43:17 <Gizmokid2005> I killed a Corsair Flash Voyager GT. Two of them actually.
16:43:22 <Gizmokid2005> completely killed the chipsets.
16:43:34 <Gizmokid2005> among other random drives.
16:43:36 <cpp_dev-geo> Read/Write too it too often?
16:43:51 <Gizmokid2005> I've been considering the idea of going to an external SSD to help but..they're too expensive.
16:43:51 <Gizmokid2005> Yep
16:44:36 <Gizmokid2005> I use portableapps all day every day. I run Firefox, Thunderbird, Skype, Pidgin, PuTTY, KVIrc, Notepad++ and VLC regularly, among the other apps I use on it occasionally...
16:44:45 <cpp_dev-geo> My problem is that from time to time I forget to take it out and stuff the laptop in a back, bending the drive into little bitty pieces...
16:44:58 <Gizmokid2005> haha, I did that to one of my early drives
16:45:01 <Gizmokid2005> that was a sad sad day.
16:45:43 <cpp_dev-geo> It's why I try to back-up once a week and back-up every-time I download and install a new app.
16:48:27 <Gizmokid2005> I backup every night since that happened.
16:48:41 <Gizmokid2005> it's part of my nightly ritual of shutting my computer down.
16:49:10 <cpp_dev-geo> :). I'd never get my computer turned off if I added something like that...
16:49:31 <Gizmokid2005> haha, mine never gets shut off but to reboot or for hardware replacement/etc.
16:49:38 <cpp_dev-geo> It already takes me like 30-1hr to get all the apps, etc I'm running, e-mails, etc closed out and put away
16:50:20 <Gizmokid2005> and you see reason #2 I went to a FVGT drive and then to an external drive
16:50:25 <Gizmokid2005> and why I'm considering an SSD
16:50:40 <Gizmokid2005> I run so many apps it still takes me nearly 5 minutes to get everything shut down properly, etc and closed out.
16:50:57 <Gizmokid2005> I mount everything inside a TrueCrypt container too, so that causes a bit of slowdown.
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18:02:32 <kAlug> ChrisMorgan: There's a TODO in PAL's Language.nsh that I believe it's about adding the ability to read/write to the Registry. Is that still desirable? (I mean, most of time INI+.reg is the right way to do it)
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18:10:52 <ChrisMorgan> kAlug: I don't think it is desired, any more. I think INI is the way we should do it, though it does have the two suboptimal things (a) quoting the key name (and value when writing) and (b) using the full hive name rather than the four-letter abbreviation.
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18:16:23 <kAlug> OK. Perhaps a RegistryFile?
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18:18:41 <ChrisMorgan> kAlug: nah, I think for the moment at least just use Type=INI. We could put in a Type=Registry which would sort out those two things, but for the moment I don't think it's worth it.
18:18:50 <kAlug> I'm working on some TODOs I've found. Where is ProgramExecutable environment-parsed?
18:19:44 <ChrisMorgan> It isn't. That's one thing which we may wish to change with %PAL:Bits% - the ability to just have ProgramExecutable=AppName%PAL:Bits%\appname.exe instead of ProgramExecutable + ProgramExecutable64 could be nice.
18:20:29 <kAlug> So the docs are wrong... again. By the way, did you got my memo?
18:21:49 <kAlug> Also, for HideCommandLineWindow+WaitForProgram=false, did you tried ExecDos::exec /ASYNC?
18:25:21 <ChrisMorgan> Wait, what's wrong with the docs?
18:25:46 <ChrisMorgan> I have not tried ExecDos::exec /ASYNC.
18:26:22 <ChrisMorgan> I got your memo. But I don't really see the need to put it in 2.1.1. It's not a bug, it's a noted caution.
18:27:33 <kAlug> All ProgramExecutables are marked with |envsub|.
18:28:45 <kAlug> I think that at least 422b38b1b120 (the note) is a good idea.
18:31:47 <ChrisMorgan> Hmm. And somehow I had it as |envsub| right from the start. How did I manage that?
18:32:28 <ChrisMorgan> The problem with applying |envsub| to it is that it's the first part of Init, so only the Core variables are there. It would really only be useful for PAL:Bits.
18:33:57 <kAlug> Would anything else be necessary?
18:35:10 <kAlug> Or useful?
18:36:17 <ChrisMorgan> I don't think so, but if we make it genuinely |envsub| then we should add a note saying that due to the time that it's evaluated, %PAL:Bits% is the only environment variable which should be used.
18:39:48 <kAlug> We can also just remove |envsub| and keep it as-is. And rethink this decision for 128-bit processors.
18:53:50 <ChrisMorgan> Hah! Who cares about 128-bit processors yet?
18:56:18 <ChrisMorgan> Sorry, I'm off to bed now. In bed, actually. Just leaving this on while I build MuseScore so I can use it tomorrow afternoon...
18:56:50 <kAlug> OK. So, remove |envsub|?
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18:59:06 <ChrisMorgan> I guess so for 2.1.1.
19:01:12 <kAlug> OK. 2.1.1 only, by now. G'night.
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