IRC Log from 2011-09-19
00:00:27 <ChrisMorgan> Doesn't look right.
00:01:43 <kAlug_> I'm going to push a fix to UTF-16 support and the language environment variables.
00:02:15 <ChrisMorgan> Actually, I'm not entirely sure if FileReadWord can be used safely for detecting if a file is UTF-16LE. I can't remember well enough.
00:02:53 <kAlug_> A small check in the Generator worked.
00:03:24 <ChrisMorgan> Good.
00:03:32 <ChrisMorgan> So long as it doesn't break other encodings!
00:09:09 <kAlug_> I can't test for KOI8-R ;)
00:09:42 <kAlug_> I think what we should support is ASCII and UTF-16LE.
00:14:08 <kAlug_> The Generator will automatically update the language variables in Custom.nsh and App\AppInfo\Launcher\*.ini.
00:23:16 <kAlug_> ChrisMorgan: Are you fixing any other bug for PAL 2.1.2.
00:23:54 <ChrisMorgan> UTF-8, too, to some degree (I'd like it, anyway), but we can consider it to be approximately ASCII.
00:24:20 <ChrisMorgan> Are there any other bugs which can be fixed for PAL 2.1.2?
00:25:38 <kAlug_> No AFAIK.
00:26:05 <kAlug_> I'll merge 2.1 in default then.
00:32:22 <kAlug_> ChrisMorgan: how do I make Mercurial ignore a specific changeset when merging a branch?
00:35:09 <ChrisMorgan> Which aren't you wishing to merge?
00:36:30 <ChrisMorgan> It's safe to `hg merge`, you know; if it goes wrong, `hg update --clean .`. Or even `hg merge -P` to see what it'd suggest.
00:38:12 <kAlug_> I don't want it to merge "Updated version number to 2.1.1 (2.1.1.0)". But I'll let it for you so you can merge it with the 2.1.2 release notes already.
00:38:36 <ChrisMorgan> Yeah, may as well not merge it yet. I'll take care of it.
00:38:52 <kAlug_> BTW, can you check the language-table.py script and base it in the latest Platform Next?
00:39:22 <ChrisMorgan> I was running it on Saturday and finding issues... that's the problems I was reporting with the .locale files.
00:39:25 <kAlug_> And check some of your comments in languages.rst.
00:40:05 <ChrisMorgan> I tend to find the easiest way to do it is to run the merge, revert that particular change and then commit.
00:43:03 <ChrisMorgan> You can use the transplant extension (equivalent of git cherry-pick) but then the tree isn't being merged which makes it harder later.
00:44:15 <kAlug_> OK... all changes in the server.
00:53:59 <ChrisMorgan> Why PAL:LocaleName rather than PAL:LanguageName?
00:58:34 <ChrisMorgan> And John *still* hasn't fixed all those locale bugs I reported back at 2.0b4 and have reported each new version!
01:00:19 <kAlug_> Hmm... not sure about LocaleName... do you want me to change it?
01:01:21 <kAlug_> Oh, now I remember it: languages don't include the country.
01:02:34 <kAlug_> The only exception is LanguageCode, because that's the official name.
01:02:52 <kAlug_> It seems that I've forgot LocaleID.
01:04:05 <ChrisMorgan> Should we just change everything to "locale", including PAL:LanguageCustom?
01:05:10 <kAlug_> I think language is more known.
01:05:10 <ChrisMorgan> Love the length of the macro SetEnvironmentVariableFromEnvironmentVariableWithDefault. 56 characters certainly isn't bad. Could have made it shorter as "SEVFEVWD" ;-)
01:06:04 <kAlug_> Yeah, I know that.
01:06:08 <ChrisMorgan> I'd just tend to like it to be more consistent, one way or another.
01:06:32 <kAlug_> What about SetEnvironmentVariableFromEnvironmentVariableWithDefaultFromAnotherEnvironmentVariable?
01:07:24 <ChrisMorgan> At the very least, put "Yet" in there - SetEnvironmentVariableFromEnvironmentVariableWithDefaultFromYetAnotherEnvironmentVariable
01:08:03 <ChrisMorgan> SetEnvironmentVariableFromEnvironmentVariableWithDefaultFromAnotherEnvironmentVariableWowThisIsTheLongestMacroNameIHaveEverComeAcross
01:08:17 <ChrisMorgan> That is to say, SetEnvironmentVariableFromEnvironmentVariableWithDefaultFromYetAnotherEnvironmentVariableWowThisIsTheLongestMacroNameIHaveEverComeAcross
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01:08:50 <ChrisMorgan> Can we come up with a place to use it?
01:09:27 <kAlug_> Not yet. I think.
01:10:01 <ChrisMorgan> Pity.
01:10:34 <kAlug_> So, replace all with Language?
01:10:41 <ChrisMorgan> I dunno.
01:11:07 <ChrisMorgan> Your point is valid about Microsoft calling it Locale ID, but I think I do like the idea of consistency.
01:11:21 <ChrisMorgan> Is PAL:LanguageLocaleID too horrible, I wonder?
01:12:21 <ChrisMorgan> Got it: SetEnvironmentVariableFromEnvironmentVariableWithDefaultFromYetAnotherEnvironmentVariableWowThisIsTheLongestMacroNameIHaveEverComeAcrossIWonderIfNSISHasAMacroNameLengthLimitIfSoWeMustBeGettingNearItIImagineThatItIsProbably256CharactersAndUnfortunatelyThisMacroNameIsLongerThanThatAsItIs303CharactersLong
01:13:59 <kAlug_> Hmm... John also prefers Locale... am I the one who prefers Language (perhaps because English is not my native language and I don't know how to translate "locale")?
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01:16:07 <kAlug_> Currently, only *Code are Language; the remaining are all Locale.
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01:17:36 <ChrisMorgan> I prefer "language" for general use but "locale" is more accurate when including country/dialect information.
01:18:23 <ChrisMorgan> Then also consider GTK itself uses the LANG environment variable as its principal locale-switching variable (plus the LC_* variables - locale!)...
01:18:45 <ChrisMorgan> Fun stuff.
01:19:21 <ChrisMorgan> And I think that LanguageCode would be more accurate as LocaleCode, considering pt and pt-br...
01:19:39 <ChrisMorgan> I'm now leaning towards switching them all to Locale, I think.
01:20:14 <ChrisMorgan> And making the NSIS one obsolete in 2.3!
01:20:52 <ChrisMorgan> But then, we use [Language], PAL:LanguageCustom, etc.
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01:20:58 <ChrisMorgan> I DON'T KNOW! :-)
01:21:27 <ChrisMorgan> Perhaps keep PAL:LanguageCustom and keep the other Locale ones Locale and change LanguageCode to LocaleCode.
01:21:44 <ChrisMorgan> After all, it's then only changing one value.
01:22:32 <ChrisMorgan> Sound OK?
01:22:35 <kAlug_> The rule is simple: *Code is Language; * is Locale. After all, you'll need to check to now which one to use.
01:22:57 <kAlug_> s/now/k&/
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02:22:58 <GordCaswell> ZachThibeau: I tried switching to PChat today, but there weren't any sounds that i could find. I was using Pchat Portable.
02:23:38 <ZachThibeau> by default PChat doesn't include sounds, it can make use of sounds though
02:24:16 <GordCaswell> Ah, ok. In that case it makes perfect sense. ./sounds just be in Data?
02:24:27 <GordCaswell> *just/should
02:24:35 <ZachThibeau> yes
02:24:41 <GordCaswell> K, thanks.
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02:31:58 <maxh> I’m trying to set up GPG (ideally with WinPT, but GPA would be okay too) on a portable disk. However, it defaults to using the keyring of my local install. Is there a way to change this behaviour to use the keyrings on the portable disk?
02:33:29 <kAlug_> maxh: You can set the GNUPGHOME environment variable to the directory of the portable keyring.
02:33:56 <maxh> This would have to be set on any computer I use, though, right?
02:35:52 <kAlug_> Yash. Or you can make a small batch file to run WinPT Portable (check if there's a file named App\AppInfo\Launcher\WinPTPortable.ini in the WinPT Portable's install first, it'll make things easier).
02:37:05 <maxh> There’s not.
02:37:52 <maxh> So just set up a batch file to change the environment variable then launch WinPT, and use that instead of launching directly, right?
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02:39:27 <kAlug_> Yes.
02:42:45 <maxh> Hrm. Now it’s complaining about a pre-existing keys conflict...
02:46:16 <kAlug_> What's the exact error message?
02:46:32 <kAlug_> From GPG or WinPT?
02:46:47 <maxh> It seems to be from WinPT.
02:51:30 <maxh> Ah, I see. It’s not using .. to go up a directory. Is there a way for the batch file to determine the drive from which it is run?
02:53:15 <kAlug_> %~d0. You can also use %~dp0 to specify the directory where the batch file is located, just remember that it already includes a backslash, so use something like %~dp0Data....
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02:58:23 <maxh> And %~d0 would be X:\?
02:59:17 <maxh> Oh, just X:.
02:59:41 <maxh> Hrm. It still says pre-existing keys conflict.
03:01:25 <maxh> If I open WinPT.exe directly (without the portable launcher) it opens.
03:06:07 <kAlug_> X:
03:07:19 <kAlug_> Can you paste the contents of the Other\Source\WinPTPortable.nsi file to some pastebin, e.g. https://pzt.me/ ?
03:09:24 <maxh> https://pzt.me/8v99
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03:21:19 <kAlug_> maxh: Hmm... that WinPT Portable release (http://portableapps.com/node/11404 I believe) is very old... and I'm running out of time. Do you mind coming back tommorow? I'll try to update WinPT Portable and reproduce the bug you're experiencing.
03:21:34 <maxh> Tomorrow works.
03:22:10 <kAlug_> OK. By the way, are you aware that WinPT is discontinued?
03:22:36 <maxh> What are people supposed to use now?
03:25:06 <kAlug_> It seems that Gpg4win (a Windows build of GPG that used to include WinPT) is now including GPA and Kleopatra: http://gpg4win.org/about.html
03:27:09 <maxh> I can’t find information about Kleopatra, but personally I prefer WinPT to GPA.
03:28:38 <kAlug_> Me too, when I used to use GPG.
03:30:12 <kAlug_> Well, I have to go now. I'll see what I can do tomorrow.
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03:30:40 <GordCaswell> spamflood by user 186845
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09:27:23 <bencc> where can I find the development versions of apps?
09:27:35 <bencc> I want to repackage the chrome portable app
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10:51:05 <pa_3667> hi
10:51:29 <pa_3667> anybody?
10:51:44 <pa_3667> hello?
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11:08:21 <pa_3667> help
11:11:02 <ChrisMorgan> pa_3667: what are you needing help with?
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11:49:02 <bencc> how can I change the chrome app and repackage it?
11:57:05 <ChrisMorgan> bencc: what for?
11:59:33 <bencc> ChrisMorgan: I want to change stuff in the ini file and install it on several computers
11:59:49 <ChrisMorgan> Just copying the directory is the easiest way, then.
12:00:16 <bencc> ok
12:00:30 <ChrisMorgan> But if you're using it on a local machine, I'd generally recommend using Google Chrome rather than Google Chrome Portable.
12:00:37 <bencc> I'm trying to change AdditionalParameters=--proxy-pac-url=http://..
12:00:56 <bencc> with a remote url it works
12:01:07 <bencc> but I can't make it work with file:///proxy.pac
12:01:30 <bencc> what's wrong with using the portable version?
12:02:39 <bencc> I placed the proxy.pac file at GoogleChromePortable/
12:04:40 <ChrisMorgan> What, exactly "file:///proxy.pac"?
12:05:00 <bencc> yes
12:05:12 <bencc> http://portableapps.com/node/365
12:05:25 <bencc> the above forum post suggest that that's the syntax
12:05:32 <bencc> I also tried resource:///proxy.pac
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12:49:24 <kAlug> ChrisMorgan: It seems that you've got my message. What do you think?
12:49:49 <kAlug> (For the logs: PAL language environment variables' naming)
12:52:50 <ChrisMorgan> kAlug: I like using LCID instead of LocaleID when tacked with Language, but I don't really like any of the other things. I think my current preference is PortableApps.com(Locale|Language)* -> PAL:Language* plus PortableApps.comLocaleID to PAL:LanguageLCID. For some reason PAL:Language:* doesn't feel neat, plus we already have PAL:LanguageCustom.
12:58:53 <kAlug> OK, I have to go now. I think I can do that. ChrisMorgan: Please add '<meta charset="utf-8"/>' to the IRC logs' HTML.
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13:10:23 <ChrisMorgan> Good idea. <meta charset="utf-8"> added.
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21:11:45 <pa_7006> help
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21:13:05 <pa_7006> ronjin
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21:13:51 <pa_7006> sar3th
21:15:59 <gluxon> pa_7006: What do you need help with?
21:16:08 <pa_7006> sar3th: can you help me with a portap Thunderbird issue?
21:16:47 <pa_7006> pa_7006: I need help with a Thunderbird portable app installed on my Ironkey
21:17:36 <pa_7006> gluxon: I need help with a Thunderbird portable app installed on my Ironkey I am just getting the hand of this irc
21:17:49 <gluxon> Could you explain your issue?
21:19:25 <pa_7006> I installed TBird and it worked fine. Yesterday it started taking forever to do anything. two days ago it started giving e a badlist something or other error message when I tried to send email via my gamil account. It has been unresponsive for the last 30 minutes.
21:20:10 <pa_7006> I suppose I am unclear whether it is an Ironkey issue or a TBird issue.
21:24:58 <pa_7006> gluxon: Right now the bar at the bottom right of the screen is slowly slowly moving to the right . At the left end of the bottom are the words "No messages to download."
21:27:57 <gluxon> How many other programs are you running of it now?
21:28:24 <pa_7006> gluxon: on the ironkey only TBird
21:29:04 <pa_7006> gluxon: on the laptop only Firefox
21:29:19 <gluxon> pa_7006: Have you tried a reinstall?
21:29:45 <pa_7006> gluxon: Yes this morning. No help.
21:30:00 <gluxon> I'm not sure what the problem could be then.
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21:30:53 <pa_7006> gluxon: Might it be an Ironkey issue?
21:31:18 <gluxon> Could be, but I don't have any knowledge about Ironkey drives.
21:31:30 <DannyMuniz> pa_7006: could you try deleting the data folder and see if that helps
21:31:52 <gluxon> DannyMuniz: That's the same as a re-install, which pa_7006 already reported doing.
21:31:58 <gluxon> Any extensions installed?
21:32:13 <pa_7006> not yet
21:33:08 <pa_7006> Does TBird automatically compact folders after the filters run?
21:34:25 <pa_7006> For that matter does TBird automatically compact folders at any point?
21:34:40 <gluxon> I don't believe Thunderbird automatically compacts folders on an IMAP account.
21:34:47 <gluxon> Only local folders.
21:36:24 <pa_7006> Well, that may be it. I just got a message Compacting Local Folders. Because I am getting mail from several email addresses I have been directing them to the Local Inbox Folder. I am guessing compacting makes it difficult to do anything until it is finished.
21:38:14 <pa_7006> Where do I schedule compacting in TBird and what is the recommendation about when to compact?
21:41:53 <gluxon> If that's the case, reinstalling should have reset the automatic compacting.
21:44:34 <pa_7006> Thank you for your help. I will reinstall and see if that makes a difference. I may even delete the data file after backing it up off my IronKey.
21:44:41 <pa_7006> Thanks to both of you.
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23:25:42 <kAlug> (display "Hello ChrisMorgan")
23:26:37 <ChrisMorgan> ?
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23:27:34 <kAlug> Hello world in Scheme. So, how you doing?
23:30:58 <ChrisMorgan> Fine.
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